Abortion debate (2 Viewers)

[veridis]

can i add a 5a. if you are going to use comments like "all the psych journals" make sure your info is up to date and accurate. not complete bullshit

 

[!Solskjaer!]

Oh yes I'm crumbling at your feet, tears gushing out of my eyes, losing all self-confidence, digging the trench too deep, your non-argument defeating my very being - you dumb fuck.

Incase you havent learned it at school, thats called sarcasm.



Moreso becuase she was stupid enough to have a baby when she didnt want one, the first one you mentioned (rape) is an exception becuase its not necessarily the mothers fault, the rest is squarely her responsibility.



No, moron - fathers dont carry the baby, nor do they have any legaly binding say in the the question of whether the child is to be aborted. It doesent matter what the father wants.

Thank you, you deluded farkwit, you've just proven my 'loss of direction' comment.

Did I say the fathers carry the baby? Did I mention anything to do with any legal binding concerning the termination of a pregnancy? No, I didn't. I simply stated that the father has as much to do with the creation of the baby as the mother.

I'm arguing that the double standards of society are farked up. Simple.

Men just refuse to accept the responsibility.

 

[bshoc]

I think it matters, yes, seeing as you're using it to make a point and somehow refute what has already been said. I think "my sources don't matter" is probably about as good as saying "Ok, ok, everyone knows I'm talking out my arse, I give up".

Further to this, that's not actually what I've said previously at all, but you knew that seeing as you read back, or seeing as you read the last post, in which I stated my view again. If you want to walk away from this thinking you've won because you can't fucking read, good luck with it. The second it "pops out" is not where I, or anyone else as far as I can see, draws the distinction.

So in short - you're ignoring the point again and are a dumbfuck.

I don't think I'm the one missing logic here if you seriously think it's valid to compare coma victims (who were once previously conscious, and who have already spent a portion of time living their life), with an unborn baby which never so much as knew that it existed, and which does not yet have functional pain receptors.

Nervous systems and simple brain functions form VERY early in fetal deveopment.

You truly are a king among kings, good sir.

No I am but a simple man weaving my way through morons such as yourself.

My point was simply that you're kidding yourself if you think you've made a point, given that you can't so much as string together a respectable sentence. If that's how you win arguments, congratulations, you'll go far.

Yours was defeated in a few simple lines - although admitably thats nothing given your lack of intelligence - this isnt an english test incase you havent noticed, this is the internet, where even words like 1337 and H4X0R have meaning.

1. Learn to read. This will save others from repeating themselves needlessly, and from becoming frustrated with your lack of comprehension.
2. Learn to spell/type. This will lend credibility to what you are saying, in addition to making it much easier for others to understand.
3. Learn to make your points clearly. Sentences which look like the product of a damaged mind will not help your case.
4. If you intend to argue, learn to read, understand, and then discuss (with reference) that which you intend to attack.
5. Learn to provide material which supports your aforementioned criticisms, you will convince nobody with lines like "oh read all the psych journals, they'll tell you exactly the same thing!

Do this, and perhaps next time I'll be interested in serious discussion with you.

:rofl:

moron

if i couldnt do those things you listed above do you think i'd even get past high school, let alone university, even the greatests writers make common mistakes, thats why they send their manuscripts to editors.

All you can do is fuck around and make useless observations like this - you have been supremely owned already - how much more embarassment can your e-persona truly take?

 

[ogmzergrush]

Men just refuse to accept the responsibility.

hey, hey! SOME men

 

[bshoc]

Thank you, you deluded farkwit, you've just proven my 'loss of direction' comment.

Did I say the fathers carry the baby? Did I mention anything to do with any legal binding concerning the termination of a pregnancy? No, I didn't. I simply stated that the father has as much to do with the creation of the baby as the mother.

I'm arguing that the double standards of society are farked up. Simple.

Men just refuse to accept the responsibility.

Then make your own thread about how todays socailite sluts (you still call them women) have it so freaking bad the government practically shoves money down their throats when they have children, and the courts rule in their favour a truly an unequal amount of the time. If you truly want to begin with your line of thought, you should first campaign to have men accorded the same legal rights as women, before you talk about your responsibility bullshit, my parents raised me equally anyway.

 

[!Solskjaer!]

hey, hey! SOME men

Ok, SOME, like the ones making laws regarding abortions.

 

[veridis]

Nervous systems and simple brain functions form VERY early in fetal deveopment.

well then if thats all it takes to be human we better all become vegetarian VERY fast or just be thankful we live in a country without the death penalty.
the difference between simple brain functions and higher brain functions has been discussed before and in the eyes of the law and the greater scientific community simple brain functions just dont cut it. until the higher order processes develop one cannot call a foetus truly human

All you can do i fuck around and make useless observations like this - you have been supremely owned already - how much more embarassment can your e-persona truly take?

just think about that comment, and how it applies to you. then delete your account, log off and come back in a few years when you can handle critical discussion

 

[ogmzergrush]

So in short - you're ignoring the point again and are a dumbfuck.

You're mind-bendingly stupid. How is me requesting sources for the point you've just "disproven" what I've said with, a case of me ignoring the point?

Nervous systems and simple brain functions form VERY early in fetal deveopment.

Sources, relevance? You're missing both.

No I am but a simple man weaving my way through morons such as yourself.

Emphasis on simple.

Yours was defeated in a few simple lines - although admitably thats nothing given your lack of intelligence - this isnt an english test incase you havent noticed, this is the internet, where even words like 1337 and H4X0R have meaning.

Ah, so your inability to write is actually an attempt at being hip, using modern lingo? Carry on then tiger, I am impressed, so much so, in fact, that it even makes up for the fact that half the shit you've said makes little to no sense.

if i couldnt do those things you listed above do you think i'd even get past high school, let alone university, even the greatests writers make common mistakes, thats why they send their manuscripts to editors.

Don't get too ahead of yourself, you are clearly not the greatest of writers. That said, I fail to see how this makes a difference. You've made a bunch of poorly worded statements, with absolutely no backing, while at the same time criticising other views which have been stated in a much clear form, and backed up. How has anything you've said here been even remotely close to a victory for you? As far as I can see, at very best (for you), you've befuddled a few of us with a shitstorm of mind-numbingly ridiculous statements. If that's what you call a victory, like I said, good work.

All you can do i fuck around and make useless observations like this - you have been supremely owned already - how much more embarassment can your e-persona truly take?

The more time that passes, the better you get it. Keep proclaiming victory son, it'll give everyone time to translate the klingon/moron hybrid that you're rattling off.

 

[bshoc]

well then if thats all it takes to be human we better all become vegetarian VERY fast or just be thankful we live in a country without the death penalty.
the difference between simple brain functions and higher brain functions has been discussed before and in the eyes of the law and the greater scientific community simple brain functions just dont cut it. until the higher order processes develop one cannot call a foetus truly human

Who the hell mentioned - animals other than humans, plants, vegetarians, the death penalty - no-one - so why bring it up? BECUASE YOU DONT HAVE AN ARGUEMENT.

On brain functions, you could use that argument to kill off many people, including coma patients, epeleptics, some of the mentally ill etc. And if you still dont get - if its alive and human, it can be murdered, the same way jellyfish dont have brains but are still alive.

just think about that comment, and how it applies to you. then delete your account, log off and come back in a few years when you can handle critical discussion

.. no

 

[!Solskjaer!]

Then make your own thread about how todays socailite sluts (you still call them women) have it so freaking bad the government practically shoves money down their throats when they have children, and the courts rule in their favour a truly an unequal amount of the time. If you truly want to begin with your line of thought, you should first campaign to have men accorded the same legal rights as women, before you talk about your responsibility bullshit, my parents raised me equally anyway.

Dude, what the fark are you on about now?

What's with introducing things I didn't even mention?

Forget it, you're making to little sense. I'll try and make sense of it after a night of sleep.

But first, answer me this: Does it not take a sperm cell and an egg cell to create an embryo?

 

[bshoc]

Sources, relevance? You're missing both.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetal_development

• Week 3 (5th week of pregnancy - first missed menstrual period)
  • A notochord forms in the center of the embryonic disk.
  • A neural groove (future spinal cord) forms over the notochord with a brain bulge at one end.
  • Heart tubes begin to fuse.

• Week 4 (6th week of pregnancy)
  • The embryo measures 4 mm (1/8 inch) in length and begins to curve into a C shape.
  • Somites, the divisions of the future vertebra, form.
  • The heart bulges, further develops, and begins to beat in a regular rhythm.
  • Branchial arches, grooves which will form structures of the face and neck, form.
  • The neural tube closes.
  • The ears begin to form as otic pits.
  • Arm buds and a tail are visible.

Ah, so your inability to write is actually an attempt at being hip, using modern lingo? Carry on then tiger, I am impressed, so much so, in fact, that it even makes up for the fact that half the shit you've said makes little to no sense.

No it shows that I'm not the best whilst fast typing on my keyboard in the dark.

The more time that passes, the better you get it. Keep proclaiming victory son, it'll give everyone time to translate the klingon/moron hybrid that you're rattling off.

As for the topic at hand ... at which you are getting owned ...

 

[veridis]

Who the hell mentioned - animals other than humans, plants, vegetarians, the death penalty - no-one - so why bring it up? BECUASE YOU DONT HAVE AN ARGUEMENT.

On brain functions, you could use that argument to kill off many people, including coma patients, epeleptics, some of the mentally ill etc. And if you still dont get - if its alive and human, it can be murdered, the same way jellyfish dont have brains but are still alive.

alive AND HUMAN. this debate is coming down to what it is to be human. everybody else seems to think it includes higher order brain functions, consciousness and self awareness, you seem to want to change it every post.
i mention animals because you mention the brain and nervous system as if that makes a foetus human. i provided an example showing brain + nervious system does not equal human. if you cant make that link then i DO wonder how you got through high school and into uni.
you could only kill coma patients, epileptics and mentally ill if you took an extreme view unfoudned by science. taking the view backed up by modern medical knowledge you can only kill the braindead and foetus'. do you see that distinction? more to the point will you acknowledge that distinction or keep trying to construct straw man arguments to take down instead of discussing MY arguments

 

[bshoc]

Dude, what the fark are you on about now?

What's with introducing things I didn't even mention?

Forget it, you're making to little sense. I'll try and make sense of it after a night of sleep.

But first, answer me this: Does it not take a sperm cell and an egg cell to create an embryo?

Yes, but you cant abort a baby by having the father take the abortion pill.

 

[bshoc]

alive AND HUMAN. this debate is coming down to what it is to be human. everybody else seems to think it includes higher order brain functions, consciousness and self awareness, you seem to want to change it every post.
i mention animals because you mention the brain and nervous system as if that makes a foetus human. i provided an example showing brain + nervious system does not equal human. if you cant make that link then i DO wonder how you got through high school and into uni.
you could only kill coma patients, epileptics and mentally ill if you took an extreme view unfoudned by science. taking the view backed up by modern medical knowledge you can only kill the braindead and foetus'. do you see that distinction? more to the point will you acknowledge that distinction or keep trying to construct straw man arguments to take down instead of discussing MY arguments

You support murdering defenceless babies, you are a sick useless fuck, we have nothing to discuss.

 

[veridis]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetal_development

• Week 3 (5th week of pregnancy - first missed menstrual period)
  • A notochord forms in the center of the embryonic disk.
  • A neural groove (future spinal cord) forms over the notochord with a brain bulge at one end.
  • Heart tubes begin to fuse.

• Week 4 (6th week of pregnancy)
  • The embryo measures 4 mm (1/8 inch) in length and begins to curve into a C shape.
  • Somites, the divisions of the future vertebra, form.
  • The heart bulges, further develops, and begins to beat in a regular rhythm.
  • Branchial arches, grooves which will form structures of the face and neck, form.
  • The neural tube closes.
  • The ears begin to form as otic pits.
  • Arm buds and a tail are visible.

thats the source now wheres the relavence. you still havent shown why it should be illegal to terminate a being with some very basic anatomical traits shared by the majority of the animal kingdom

 

[bshoc]

thats the source now wheres the relavence. you still havent shown why it should be illegal to terminate a being with some very basic anatomical traits shared by the majority of the animal kingdom

Becuase its genetically human, and thus already, sacred, for it is already a unique being.

 

[ogmzergrush]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetal_development

• Week 3 (5th week of pregnancy - first missed menstrual period)
  • A notochord forms in the center of the embryonic disk.
  • A neural groove (future spinal cord) forms over the notochord with a brain bulge at one end.
  • Heart tubes begin to fuse.

• Week 4 (6th week of pregnancy)
  • The embryo measures 4 mm (1/8 inch) in length and begins to curve into a C shape.
  • Somites, the divisions of the future vertebra, form.
  • The heart bulges, further develops, and begins to beat in a regular rhythm.
  • Branchial arches, grooves which will form structures of the face and neck, form.
  • The neural tube closes.
  • The ears begin to form as otic pits.
  • Arm buds and a tail are visible.

You truly are fucked. Unfortunately, your wikipedia reference does not demonstrate that to kill the growth which we are discussing would be murder by the definition which I've stated was mine previously (which you read up on, remember?). Nor does it in any way invalidate my definition, as you suggested that your sources did. I also do not see references for your shit about self-awareness not happening until the child was one. Keep digging.

 

[veridis]

You support murdering defenceless babies, you are a sick useless fuck, we have nothing to discuss.

you cannot accept any logical argument nor acknowledge that according to my arguments that you have not been able to find fault with have established that foetuses until late in their development lack the required features to be classified as human. thus termination of these beings is not murder, along the same lines and turning off life support for braindead patients is not murder(the mother is pretty much life support).
you are right we have nothing to discuss because you lack the ability to have a discussion, you just talk but never listen.

as for me being a sick useless fuck we'll see whose more use in 10 years when you're in some mid level unimportant economics desk job while i'm out helping people as a psych

 

[veridis]

Becuase its genetically human, and thus already, sacred, for it is already a unique being.

as is cancer, as are organs grown in labs. you have not yet established that human genome = human life.

edit - dude just stop arguing. you have gone beyond arguing facts and logic. you are now arguing on belief. you believe something different to what evidence indicates, and thats cool, you can believe whatever you want. i mean theres no evidence for an afterlife or soul but people arnet going to argue too much with you about them not existing. just dont try to justify your beliefs to convince others in an empirical environment. beliefs are by their nature a thing of faith, a faith vs evidence argument will never be resolved.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Can't Post Pics?!

Wtf.