Aryanbeauty said:
You are entitled to dream that one day israel may cease to exist as you wish. There is nothing worth countering in your argument which is based on dreams. Yeah continue another 50 years of violence against Israel there might not be enough arabs to claim palestine then
See here you go again. Remember, all nations cease to exist eventually. Also remember, I NEVER SAID I SUPPORT VIOLENCE. So don't tell me that I wish to commit to another 50 years of violence.
Arabs lived in Israel for a thousand years, jews lived in israel for over two thousand and five hundred years. It was arabs islamic invaders that came to Israel while the land was under various empire, the main people that live in there were jews, be it Greek, Roman, Persian or Byzantine empire the majority of people living there were jews. Then came Isalmic invaders Caliph Omar to be precise, then came with him were arabs. So you arabs were clearly outsiders that came and conquer Israel/palestine and then occupy it. Even under islamic rulers of Mamaluk and Ottoman Empire, jews always lived in the land. Therefore it belongs to them.
Yes, but there was a 1000 year gap between these times. The vast majority of Jews had left to go around the world. It was not like Jews were reminicing on the "good times" in the land, they had abandoned it. Jews had lived under the Caliphs, however they took up a very small portion of the population. Arguing that it belongs to them is like me arguing that Sydney belongs to the Lebanese.
Since you arabs are mass migrating to Israel/palestine except it was long time ago. Cant we classify as you are doing exactly the same as the one you accused jews of doing it? Therefore arabs are legitimate target for Israelis too eh?
Yes exactly, it was a long time ago, and they would have been legitamite targets for Jews. But they weren't targetted. The Jews accepted our presence there, this was at a time when we were allies, with the Arabs being the stronger half.
You are wrong, Israel agreed with UN partition Plan and arabs rejected it. The rest is history with various wars started by arabs and losing it.
Of course we rejected it. The world was trying to use Arabs as a tool to save them from their own holocaust guilt. The fact was that, as small as any Israeli state would have been, we were losing our rightful territory. Do not forget that the majority of people living there at the time were Arabs, all the nations in that region are Arabs. It was foolish to go ahead and found a Jewish state without the backing of the Arabs, as it was self evident that there was going to be a continuous cycle of chaos.
Is this not Concrete
The first is the Balfour Declaration of 1917: An official letter from the British Foreign Office headed by Arthur Balfour, the UK's Foreign Secretary (from December 1916 to October 1919), to Lord Rothschild, who was seen as a representative of the Jewish people. The letter stated that the British government "view[ed] with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration
Seems like they already decided the place in 1917 :rofl: contrary to your assertion.
Notice the weakness with an agreement like that. This was made when Britain controlled Palestine as a mandate, but used it as a colony. An agreement like that was bilateral between the European country Britain and the Jewish people. It left out the opinion of the vast majority of people living there at the time, that was the Arabs.
Whether reparations are bad or not, Victors have the right to occupy and appropriate the lands because they are Victorious. Losers have no rights except whine. That is the law of nature, the law of war that has been followed throughout history. Israel does not intend to occupy the palestinian areas forever, but until violence stop then it have to do what it needs to do to protect its citizens from murderous terrorists who have nothin to do better than blowing up jet plane, schools and buses.
Once again, you are going into imperialistic, militaristic, and social Darwinist theory. The world is not survival of the fittest, where the strongest nations can occupy others and act however they wish. If you believe you know the "law of war", you would know that there is also resistance. When Israel uses its own citizens as soldiers to assist in occupation, then resistance against that is fair, as Israel is using civilians to shield itself from the consequences of its crimes. If Israel does not intend to occupy the Palestinian areas forever, then explain why settlements have been developed there, and have continued to be developed at the fastest rate possible?
challenge accomplished
Quran Chapter 5 verse 20-21 to be precise. Is nt it Apostasy to challenge Quran for muslims?
WHAT ARE YOU SMOKING? It is not apostasy to challenge Quran for Muslims, however I take offense when you simply make up verses in the Quran. Obviously you didn't think it through, and didn't realise that I in fact have a Quran, and its in English too. This is Quran Chapter 5 verse 20-21:
"For with God is the soverignty of the Heavens and of the Earth, and of all that is between them! He createth what He will; and over all things is God potent.
Say the Jews and Christians, "Sons are we of God and his Beloved". Say: Why then doth he chastise you for your sins? Nay! Ye are but a part of the men whom he hath created! He will pardon whom he pleaseth, and chastise whom he pleaseth, and with God is the soverignty of the heavens and of the Earth, and all the things between them, and unto him shall all things return"
I do not know whether you made up your quote, or whether you got it off a radical zionist source that wishes to legitamise Israel using our own Quran. Either way, its incorrect. Besides, if you knew anything about the Quran, you would know that it is not written as a drama script with everyones lines and their name in front.
Even if it is Legal, Israel is created by UN resolution On November 29, the UN General Assembly voted 33 to 13, with 10 abstentions, in favour of the Partition Plan, while making some adjustments to the boundaries between the two states proposed by it. That is Legal.
Politically Israel is created with the support of all world political leaders of that time, USA, USSR, UK, France etc agreeing to it. What more support could you get.
The support of the MAJORITY LIVING THERE. That is, the Arabs. You should also remember that the UK, USA and France were looking to shed their war guilt after the holocaust. You should also know that the USSR was trying to use it to get rid of its own Jewish population.
Thats your perception of being called an arab. And yes you identify arab with crime and that is not surprising. More evidence of you are more of a dreamer than a person who actually see the reality. When was the last time arab countries United? 1000 years ago? It was not french or brits who divided arab world, arab world was already under various independent rulers long before europeans intervened. Actually Arabs world was ruled for almost 1000 years by guess what? Turkish! Palestinian arabs are bringing those problems unto themselves and therefore they deserve it.
No, I am quite proud of being an Arab. That is why I have an Iraqi flag hanging on my wall. The fact was that your implications in the sentence "its because you're an arab arent ya" is similar to the sentence, "you're gay aren't ya" or "you're a rapist aren't ya". Using "aren't ya" to end a sentence cannot be used in a positive light.
The Arabs were last united before the Mongol invasion. We have lived as colonies ever since, however we have stayed where we are, waiting for our freedom so that we can unite. Unluckily, the Europeans came and divided us to their pleasing. There is nothing extreme or unrealistic about Pan-Arabism, it is only natural that in a world of nationstates, those of the same ethnic group unite into a single nation. People such as Bismarck united the Germans into one state after years of conflict and war between one another, and he is seen as one of the greatest Germans in history. The same can be done for the Arabs.
destruction of palestinian state? I don't remember Palestinian state being formed or destroyed. It never existed. Since independence Israel was fighting Egypt, Syria, Lebanon and Jordan can you tell me when was palestinian state formed and destroyed :rofl:
You could say that the UN partition plan, if you believe that is what created Israel, also created a Palestinian state at the same time. To me, it does not matter whether Palestine is a part of Egypt or Jordan, or whether it is on its own, as long as Arabs are leading and protecting the Arabs.
