You might want to have a look at the employment figures for the uni which you are interested in, which are quoted in this article from BRW:
The Graduate Edge
By Bruce Andrews
31 July 2003
Business Review Weekly
The Big Four cast widely for graduate recruits, but they favor only a handful of universities.
When Andrew Newcombe started studying for a bachelor of commerce degree, he did not know where he wanted to work after graduation. It was not until he attended an information session with representatives from the Big Four accounting firms, who were publicising their recruiting programs, that he set his sights on one of them because of the training opportunities they offered. But, according to BRW research, he had already unwittingly put himself at a disadvantage by choosing to study at Deakin University.
Some universities are better than others for students who have their sights set on working for the Big Four.
A study of the recruiting behavior of the Big Four accounting firms shows that, even though these firms publicise their graduate recruitment programs to every university with accounting or commerce degrees, they tend to choose most of their recruits from two or three universities from each state.
Newcombe chose Deakin because its campus in the eastern suburbs of Melbourne is more convenient to his home than the campuses of the University of Melbourne and Monash University. "I thought at the time it would be better for me to be closer to uni, so if I did have to go back and do any work I wouldn't have to jump on a train for an hour," he says.
If Newcombe had chosen on career opportunities, he might have thought again. Deakin is a clear third in Victoria for three of the Big Four firms, behind the University of Melbourne and Monash University (see table). This year, PricewaterhouseCoopers, Ernst & Young and Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu recruited 81.2% of their Victorian graduates from the top two universities. Deakin contributed 13.9% of the successful Victorian applicants. (KPMG was unable to provide figures for this year but in the incomplete sample it provided of its graduate intake for 2003, 66.7% came from Monash and the University of Melbourne combined and 22.9% came from Deakin.)
Senior human resource managers at Pricewaterhouse-Coopers and Deloitte say the dominance of Melbourne and Monash universities is not only because they have more commerce students graduating each year, but also because their careers and employment units have more resources and their student accounting associations are more active.
The University of New South Wales, the University of Technology, Sydney, and the University of Sydney provided 75.3% of all the NSW graduates recruited to three of the Big Four firms for 2004. Students from the regional universities at Wollongong and Newcastle secured only 4.9% of the Big Four's graduate intake.
Fortunately for Newcombe, he was talented enough to be offered a position with KPMG in his final year of study last year, and started work as an auditor in February. He wanted to work for one of the Big Four firms because "they easily offered the best support for doing the CA [Chartered Accountant] program". KPMG organises practice exams and offers study leave for recruits who have enrolled in the CA program.
To become a qualified accountant through the Institute of Chartered Accountants in Australia's (ICAA) CA program, a candidate must, after completing an approved degree, work for three years with an accredited firm. They must also study and pass exams for five training modules that, in total, take at least two years to complete. Candidates can start their first module only after working at a firm for at least a year. The ICAA's general manager of professional education, Gillian Cappelletto, says working in the Big Four accounting firms is popular with candidates. About 40% of the 5500 people enrolled in the CA program work in one of the Big Four firms, 45% work in other accounting firms, and 15% work for companies and government organisations.
Although university accounting courses vary in style and content, the ICAA ensures they all meet certain standards so that their students may enrol in the CA program. So, if accounting students from universities across Australia are receiving the same basic levels of training, why do the Big Four firms pick most of their recruits from a small number of elite universities?
Deloitte's national graduate recruitment manager, Lisa Michael, says universities such as Monash and Melbourne tend to have a higher calibre of student because their entrance scores are higher. The tertiary entrance rank (TER) for a first-round offer to study a commerce degree at the University of Melbourne's Parkville campus this year was 94.70, and 91.25 for the Clayton campus of Monash University. The TER for studying commerce at Deakin's Burwood campus was 86.85, and for La Trobe's Bundoora campus 80.80.
PricewaterhouseCoopers' national campus recruitment manager, Katrina Moriarty, says universities with big commerce and business faculties, such as Melbourne and Monash, have more students so she receives more applications from them. According to a document on the Commonwealth Department of Education web site, Management and Commerce Graduates by State, 2001, 846 students graduated with accounting degrees from the University of Melbourne in 2001, and 488 graduated from Deakin. PricewaterhouseCoopers received 520 applications from University of Melbourne students this year and made offers to 24 of them to join the firm in 2004, a success rate of 4.6%. The firm received 140 applications from Deakin University students and offered positions to five, a success rate of 3.6%.
Student associations play a key role in getting accounting graduates into the Big Four firms. Michael says student accounting associations are very active in creating networks and organising business-related activities in Brisbane and Perth, and particularly in Victoria.
The larger number of student associations, and their longer history, gives Melbourne and Monash students an advantage in securing a place at Deloitte. "For instance, at Deakin there is only really the Deakin Accounting & Finance Society that has any presence [on campus] and it has only been around for two years or so. Whereas at Melbourne, there are probably half a dozen really strong student societies that have an employment angle and really focus on providing their members with the opportunity to spend time with employers and put them on the best foot for receiving a graduate role."
Moriarty says student societies give students the chance to gain skills that the firm values and to meet people from the firm. "Some student societies run competitions for their students to develop their business skills. Others will have cocktail evenings and invite people from business so they can get to know them." Ernst & Young's senior manager of recruitment, Anne Carman, says university careers and employment offices are very influential in informing students about what they can expect when they apply to the Big Four. Michael and Moriarty agree. Michael says: "Melbourne and Monash would be the greatest in terms of information [made available to students about getting employed], and then Deakin and La Trobe, and then RMIT." Michael says she is invited by the careers offices at Monash and Melbourne to run workshops for students on preparing for work. "So straight away, these universities are providing access to the graduate recruiters."
Top class
1 The Big Four accounting firms picked most of their recruits for 2004 from a small number of universities in each state.
2 The large size of the accounting and business faculties, and the higher TER scores required for entry into commerce degrees at these top universities, mean their students are more likely to be recruited by the Big Four.
3 Active accounting and business-related student associations, especially in Victoria, and well-resourced university careers offices, are important factors for students who want to be recruited by the Big Four.
UNIVERSITY challenge
Graduates recruited to PricewaterhouseCoopers, Ernst & Young and Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu for 2004
VICTORIA
University of Melbourne 51
Monash University 31
Deakin University 14
La Trobe University 3
RMIT University 2
NEW SOUTH WALES / ACT
University of New South Wales 57
University of Technology, Sydney 44
University of Sydney 36
Macquarie University 18
Australian National University 9
University of Western Sydney 6
University of Wollongong 5
University of Newcastle 4
University of Canberra 3
QUEENSLAND*
University of Queensland 24
Queensland University of Technology 13
James Cook University 8
Bond University 7
Griffith University 3
Central Queensland University 1
WESTERN AUSTRALIA
University of Western Australia 26
Curtin University of Technology 20
Murdoch University 6
Edith Cowan University 5
SOUTH AUSTRALIA
University of Adelaide 14
University of South Australia 11
Flinders University of South Australia 4
TASMANIA
University of Tasmania 7
* Does not include graduate recruits for Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu
SOURCE: PRICEWATERHOUSECOOPERS, ERNST & YOUNG, DELOITTE TOUCHE TOHMATSU
The Graduate Edge
By Bruce Andrews
31 July 2003
Business Review Weekly
The Big Four cast widely for graduate recruits, but they favor only a handful of universities.
When Andrew Newcombe started studying for a bachelor of commerce degree, he did not know where he wanted to work after graduation. It was not until he attended an information session with representatives from the Big Four accounting firms, who were publicising their recruiting programs, that he set his sights on one of them because of the training opportunities they offered. But, according to BRW research, he had already unwittingly put himself at a disadvantage by choosing to study at Deakin University.
Some universities are better than others for students who have their sights set on working for the Big Four.
A study of the recruiting behavior of the Big Four accounting firms shows that, even though these firms publicise their graduate recruitment programs to every university with accounting or commerce degrees, they tend to choose most of their recruits from two or three universities from each state.
Newcombe chose Deakin because its campus in the eastern suburbs of Melbourne is more convenient to his home than the campuses of the University of Melbourne and Monash University. "I thought at the time it would be better for me to be closer to uni, so if I did have to go back and do any work I wouldn't have to jump on a train for an hour," he says.
If Newcombe had chosen on career opportunities, he might have thought again. Deakin is a clear third in Victoria for three of the Big Four firms, behind the University of Melbourne and Monash University (see table). This year, PricewaterhouseCoopers, Ernst & Young and Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu recruited 81.2% of their Victorian graduates from the top two universities. Deakin contributed 13.9% of the successful Victorian applicants. (KPMG was unable to provide figures for this year but in the incomplete sample it provided of its graduate intake for 2003, 66.7% came from Monash and the University of Melbourne combined and 22.9% came from Deakin.)
Senior human resource managers at Pricewaterhouse-Coopers and Deloitte say the dominance of Melbourne and Monash universities is not only because they have more commerce students graduating each year, but also because their careers and employment units have more resources and their student accounting associations are more active.
The University of New South Wales, the University of Technology, Sydney, and the University of Sydney provided 75.3% of all the NSW graduates recruited to three of the Big Four firms for 2004. Students from the regional universities at Wollongong and Newcastle secured only 4.9% of the Big Four's graduate intake.
Fortunately for Newcombe, he was talented enough to be offered a position with KPMG in his final year of study last year, and started work as an auditor in February. He wanted to work for one of the Big Four firms because "they easily offered the best support for doing the CA [Chartered Accountant] program". KPMG organises practice exams and offers study leave for recruits who have enrolled in the CA program.
To become a qualified accountant through the Institute of Chartered Accountants in Australia's (ICAA) CA program, a candidate must, after completing an approved degree, work for three years with an accredited firm. They must also study and pass exams for five training modules that, in total, take at least two years to complete. Candidates can start their first module only after working at a firm for at least a year. The ICAA's general manager of professional education, Gillian Cappelletto, says working in the Big Four accounting firms is popular with candidates. About 40% of the 5500 people enrolled in the CA program work in one of the Big Four firms, 45% work in other accounting firms, and 15% work for companies and government organisations.
Although university accounting courses vary in style and content, the ICAA ensures they all meet certain standards so that their students may enrol in the CA program. So, if accounting students from universities across Australia are receiving the same basic levels of training, why do the Big Four firms pick most of their recruits from a small number of elite universities?
Deloitte's national graduate recruitment manager, Lisa Michael, says universities such as Monash and Melbourne tend to have a higher calibre of student because their entrance scores are higher. The tertiary entrance rank (TER) for a first-round offer to study a commerce degree at the University of Melbourne's Parkville campus this year was 94.70, and 91.25 for the Clayton campus of Monash University. The TER for studying commerce at Deakin's Burwood campus was 86.85, and for La Trobe's Bundoora campus 80.80.
PricewaterhouseCoopers' national campus recruitment manager, Katrina Moriarty, says universities with big commerce and business faculties, such as Melbourne and Monash, have more students so she receives more applications from them. According to a document on the Commonwealth Department of Education web site, Management and Commerce Graduates by State, 2001, 846 students graduated with accounting degrees from the University of Melbourne in 2001, and 488 graduated from Deakin. PricewaterhouseCoopers received 520 applications from University of Melbourne students this year and made offers to 24 of them to join the firm in 2004, a success rate of 4.6%. The firm received 140 applications from Deakin University students and offered positions to five, a success rate of 3.6%.
Student associations play a key role in getting accounting graduates into the Big Four firms. Michael says student accounting associations are very active in creating networks and organising business-related activities in Brisbane and Perth, and particularly in Victoria.
The larger number of student associations, and their longer history, gives Melbourne and Monash students an advantage in securing a place at Deloitte. "For instance, at Deakin there is only really the Deakin Accounting & Finance Society that has any presence [on campus] and it has only been around for two years or so. Whereas at Melbourne, there are probably half a dozen really strong student societies that have an employment angle and really focus on providing their members with the opportunity to spend time with employers and put them on the best foot for receiving a graduate role."
Moriarty says student societies give students the chance to gain skills that the firm values and to meet people from the firm. "Some student societies run competitions for their students to develop their business skills. Others will have cocktail evenings and invite people from business so they can get to know them." Ernst & Young's senior manager of recruitment, Anne Carman, says university careers and employment offices are very influential in informing students about what they can expect when they apply to the Big Four. Michael and Moriarty agree. Michael says: "Melbourne and Monash would be the greatest in terms of information [made available to students about getting employed], and then Deakin and La Trobe, and then RMIT." Michael says she is invited by the careers offices at Monash and Melbourne to run workshops for students on preparing for work. "So straight away, these universities are providing access to the graduate recruiters."
Top class
1 The Big Four accounting firms picked most of their recruits for 2004 from a small number of universities in each state.
2 The large size of the accounting and business faculties, and the higher TER scores required for entry into commerce degrees at these top universities, mean their students are more likely to be recruited by the Big Four.
3 Active accounting and business-related student associations, especially in Victoria, and well-resourced university careers offices, are important factors for students who want to be recruited by the Big Four.
UNIVERSITY challenge
Graduates recruited to PricewaterhouseCoopers, Ernst & Young and Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu for 2004
VICTORIA
University of Melbourne 51
Monash University 31
Deakin University 14
La Trobe University 3
RMIT University 2
NEW SOUTH WALES / ACT
University of New South Wales 57
University of Technology, Sydney 44
University of Sydney 36
Macquarie University 18
Australian National University 9
University of Western Sydney 6
University of Wollongong 5
University of Newcastle 4
University of Canberra 3
QUEENSLAND*
University of Queensland 24
Queensland University of Technology 13
James Cook University 8
Bond University 7
Griffith University 3
Central Queensland University 1
WESTERN AUSTRALIA
University of Western Australia 26
Curtin University of Technology 20
Murdoch University 6
Edith Cowan University 5
SOUTH AUSTRALIA
University of Adelaide 14
University of South Australia 11
Flinders University of South Australia 4
TASMANIA
University of Tasmania 7
* Does not include graduate recruits for Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu
SOURCE: PRICEWATERHOUSECOOPERS, ERNST & YOUNG, DELOITTE TOUCHE TOHMATSU
