The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny (1 Viewer)

[HumanDichotomy]

We had this as a debating topic...just wondering what people think?

EDIT: Should this be allowable? Should we be able to scrutinise and then intervene?

 

[Iron]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

they
are

 

[HumanDichotomy]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

Yes. But the question posed was not '*Are* they?' it was '*Should* they be?'. One questions whether the state of affairs exists, the other questions the legitimacy of this state of affairs...

Obviously, if it was so straighforward, it wouldn't have been given as a debating topic.

 

[Tangent]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

I think that as a member in the global community we have a duty to look out for everyone. Stand up for justice and all that stuff. Even though i believe it, there is no way to actually make any other country do anything, except put pressure on the country through sanctions, beside going to war with them.

We are all human beings, regardless of the imaginary borders drawn across the globe.

 

[Iron]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

Yes. But the question posed was not '*Are* they?' it was '*Should* they be?'. One questions whether the state of affairs exists, the other questions the legitimacy of this state of affairs...

Obviously, if it was so straighforward, it wouldn't have been given as a debating topic.

The topic is a statement, not a question. This implies that they are not under such scrutiny. U are gay.

 

[HumanDichotomy]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

The topic is a statement, not a question. This implies that they are not under such scrutiny. U are gay.

Hmm. Yes. Obviously your inability to interpret the topic is a definitive indication of my sexuality...

 

[murphyad]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

The topic is a statement, not a question. This implies that they are not under such scrutiny. U are gay.

I dunno if you read the OP, but as a debating topic this implies a 'for' or 'against' position at the very least. So stop with the pointless ad hominem catfights.

 

[SnowFox]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

Nah he gets pissy around HD because he always gets smacked with anti-catholic talk.

 

[Random_dude]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

well i think they can all just be left to their own devices. when we internationally scrutinising another nation's culture and actions from a completely different attitude, culture, and level of freedom. however, America, loving democracy so much, wants to share it with everyone. that is why we internationally scrutinising these countries anyway. in the end, if they WANT us to internationally scrutinise them, they can ask for it. what are they going to with "bad country, bad"? they are going to ignore it so why are we putting ourselves through all this trouble just so we can go internationally scrutinising other countries?

 

[Garygaz]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

well i think they can all just be left to their own devices. when we internationally scrutinising another nation's culture and actions from a completely different attitude, culture, and level of freedom. however, America, loving democracy so much, wants to share it with everyone. that is why we internationally scrutinising these countries anyway. in the end, if they WANT us to internationally scrutinise them, they can ask for it. what are they going to with "bad country, bad"? they are going to ignore it so why are we putting ourselves through all this trouble just so we can go internationally scrutinising other countries?

Hai let's not scrutinise North Korea, Iran, Russia, Pakistan, Syria etc etc etc and see what happens. Leave them to their own devices? You wouldn't want this.

 

[Tangent]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

they are going to ignore it so why are we putting ourselves through all this trouble just so we can go internationally scrutinising other countries?

Whats the point in living if we are going to die anyway?
The point of all of it is to hope to make an impact. It isnt always successful, but if we give it a go the chance is always going to be there

 

[Kolefax]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

If we scrutinise other countries, and thus condemn them for things that are not right, this helps keep them inline.
Public oppinion has alot of power these days.

 

[loquasagacious]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

Yes I think that domestic politics should be subject to international scrutiny or rather discussion. All part of transparent and participatory government imo.

 

[Smile_Time351]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

I also had this as a debate topic and, despite my team's defeat, was lucky enough to receive the negative side, which corresponds with my viewpoint. I personally am a great advocater of State Sovreignty, and am one of the few who believe in fighting the tide of internationalism, not stopping it, just slowing it down. International scrutiny is overall a noble ideal (see UN), but practically unsound (see also UN).

 

[ad infinitum]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

I also had this as a debate topic and, despite my team's defeat, was lucky enough to receive the negative side, which corresponds with my viewpoint. I personally am a great advocater of State Sovreignty, and am one of the few who believe in fighting the tide of internationalism, not stopping it, just slowing it down. International scrutiny is overall a noble ideal (see UN), but practically unsound (see also UN).

I think this is a dangerous stance to take. I am a moral realist and believe that some cultures are simply better than others; that is they have better moral outcomes. E.g One could say that Albino poaching in some African countries is simply a 'cultural difference' and that the West should 'respect' their sovreignty. Or that 'Honor Killing' is a mere 'cultural' difference and that Western cultures have no ability/moral authority to comment/recommend alternatives. I am not proposing that only one culture is the 'right' or 'best' culture, in the same way that I would not propose that one food is the right food or best food. But that does not obviate the distinction between Food and Poisen.
There may not be one narrow stream of 'right' cultures or practices but admitting this does not obviate the distinction between right and wrong.

 

[murphyad]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

Are you sure that you do not mean Sovereign Immunity?

International scrutiny is overall a noble ideal (see UN), but practically unsound (see also UN).

A bit of circular logic here. The UN is hamstrung by it's consistent upholding of sovereign immunity making it somewhat ineffective in the international sphere. However you use this as your justification for sovereign immunity (or state sovereignty if thats what you meant), meaning that you use your conclusion as an argumentative premise. Perhaps if the UN did not pander so much to the interests of states, it would be more successful in achieving its goals.

As ad infinitum says, yours is a dangerous stance to take. You sound like a bit of a statist reactionary (first opinions are not always right, however) and I personally do not condone the observance of state sovereignty on the basis of my belief in universal human rights that should not be obstructed by one's nationality.

 

[HumanDichotomy]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

Are you sure that you do not mean Sovereign Immunity?



A bit of circular logic here. The UN is hamstrung by it's consistent upholding of sovereign immunity making it somewhat ineffective in the international sphere. However you use this as your justification for sovereign immunity (or state sovereignty if thats what you meant), meaning that you use your conclusion as an argumentative premise. Perhaps if the UN did not pander so much to the interests of states, it would be more successful in achieving its goals.

As ad infinitum says, yours is a dangerous stance to take. You sound like a bit of a statist reactionary (first opinions are not always right, however) and I personally do not condone the observance of state sovereignty on the basis of my belief in universal human rights that should not be obstructed by one's nationality.

Gotta love that tone of yours.

 

[HumanDichotomy]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

A bit of circular logic here.

International scrutiny is overall a noble ideal (see UN), but practically unsound (see also UN).

Whilst I agree with you, murphy, don't you think we used very similar logic during said debate?

 

[murphyad]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

I suppose we did. But who cares - we only had to convince them that it actualy made sense, after all.

 

[HumanDichotomy]

Re: The domestic affairs of countries should be subjected to international scrutiny..

I suppose we did. But who cares - we only had to convince them that it actualy made sense, after all.

Haha, yeah, I know...just being the devil's advocate.

But anyway, even leaving aside the whole human rights argument, I think that the whole argument in terms of 'let's leave them to their own devices' is ultimately hypocritical. I mean, were we leaving Afghanistan, Iraq, Korean or Vietnam to *their* own devices? To argue the right of other nations to have sovereign immunity, when Australia has consistently violated this right over the last few decades, is frankly ridiculous.