TAIWAN INDEPENDENCE: Unites States & China....? (2 Viewers)

[Not-That-Bright]

Well the government in taiwan used to rule mainland china... they lost they war, however there has yet to be a war over taiwan so i'd say they rule it.

 

[funky_mushroom]

I know alot about the situation, i also feel that the taiwanese USED to want independance... but as china is becoming a more democratic nation the people of taiwan are open to unity.

I think this is a moot discussion because i believe in the end the people of taiwan will want to be a part of china.

taiwan is kinda divided about that =\ i fink half of the taiwanese population wants it to stay the way it is now while the other half wants independance.. personally as a taiwanese citizen i'll rather it stay the way it is now and cut all the independence crap. im sure there are better things to spend money on than weapons =)

 

[Phanatical]

You can't be a citizen of a province. I am not a citizen of New South Wales, but a citizen of Australia.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Actually you are a new south wales citizen.... u vote in new south wales elections.. you are also a citizen of your town.

 

[Phanatical]

Incorrect! Citizenship refers to legal membership within a nation state, and therefore I am a citizen of Australia, and not of New South Wales, or Greystanes, as neither New South Wales nor Greystanes can be considered Nation States.

 

[Generator]

Notions of citisenship are (forever) changing, Phanatical.

 

[Xayma]

taiwan is kinda divided about that =\ i fink half of the taiwanese population wants it to stay the way it is now while the other half wants independance.. personally as a taiwanese citizen i'll rather it stay the way it is now and cut all the independence crap. im sure there are better things to spend money on than weapons =)

The main group that wants to become part of China are those who left China for Taiwan during the revolution. Those who viewed themselves as Taiwanese (going back before the revolution) are much more in support of independance.

Also interesting is that a large amount of the population was (is) willing to fight if communists invaded, this drops down significantly if they claim independance.

Ultimately I think the only situation that will be stable is the current status quo, but that could be seen as a breach of one of China's automatic war conditions, and then there will be blood shed for not much point.

 

[Phanatical]

The only stable situation is one where China is completely united under the Government of the PRC.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

And that is what i think will happen... not because china wants it but because the majority of the people of taiwan want it...

China needs to make the people of taiwan a better deal, telling them that they will maintain pretty much the same way of life they're used to.

 

[funky_mushroom]

lol well taiwan has diff laws to china and they issue their own passports and ID cards and shit so im just gunna say i am a citizen of this province =)

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Yea actually that's a good point... if this 'provice' has been operating under it's own laws etc without chinese interferance... wouldn't that mean it is now its own country?

 

[funky_mushroom]

to be honest while i was living there i was always under the impression that taiwan is its own country o_o but i dont know anyone in taiwan who wants to be completely unified with china... but i dont support the govt trying to completely break away from china tho =|

 

[Not-That-Bright]

If you don't support taiwan separating from china.. i guess u don't support east timors separation from indonesia? or americas separation from england?

 

[funky_mushroom]

hehz i wont comment on east timor n' indonesia since i dont kno anything about it =)
i dont support total separation because it might lead to blood shed which is quite pointless... yer

 

[loquasagacious]

Well technically taiwan is a country, it is China. When Chiang Kai Shek and the nationalists fled to formosa (taiwan) they established a 'governmnet in exile' sort of thing and claim to be the legal ruler of china. So there are in fact two chinas a communist and a nationalist one, physically they occupy differing areas, legally and morally they each claim to occupy the entirity of the other. Taiwan's laws/passports etc are Chinese.

Hence diplomatically there are huge implications for cuntries giving the Peoples Republic of China recognition as the legal rulers of China and vica versa. It wasn't until Nixon that the US recognised PROC.

 

[Phanatical]

Technically it is a province of China. It is not an independent country, it is not the Capital of China, it is a province of China.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Technically East Timor was a province of indonesia... Technically America was a settlement of the British

 

[berry580]

Technically it is a province of China. It is not an independent country, it is not the Capital of China, it is a province of China.

To Not-That-Bright:

You know, if this world is simple as you think, then almost anyone in this world can be a politician.
There are categories where you can put situations in, but there can be exceptional situations and grey areas. Also, unlike how everyone may have thought, international affairs ain't always as logical as you might have thought. (e.g US recognised Taiwan (Republic of China) to be part of mainland China (People's Republic of China), but still sells arms to Taiwan. Does that mean the Amercans are arming the Chinese rebels?)
The situation of all cases may vary as much as they want, but they all have a similarity- all of their aim is for the government's benefit, regardless it's short or long term, militarily or politically.

Like what Phanatical has said, Taiwan is technically a province of China, and is politically recognised worldwide backed by the UN. But it reality, it's a country by definition, as it has a separate government and its own defence force.

Technically America was a settlement of the British

And in reality, the white settlers stole (i.e Take by force, possibly with firearms) indigenous American's land.

And in reality, the white settlers massacred (i.e to kill indiscriminately) indigenous Americans and raped (i.e to forcibly undress a female victim, spread her legs forcibly and the horny bastard/s shoves his 1 inch in the victims vagina) indigenous American women.

And in reality, the white settlers are not much more than thieves, murderers and rapists, end of story.

Therefore technically, America is a piece of land stolen by the British thieves, murderers and rapists from the indigenous Americans. Just like how Australia is.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

The PROC did the exact same thing as they took china from the ROC.....

 

[Generator]

You should take an Arts (History) degree at uni, berry. You would set the world alight!