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Students to be taught there isn't a God in Victorian schools (3 Viewers)

P.T.F.E

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Kwayera said:
Lol, you have no idea what you are talking about.
i have noo idea
u are soo smart
i should listen to u about my own religion
U clebrating christmas this year
do u know y
because all u have is pathetic facts
about ancient whatever
URS are correct and mine are wrong
give me a break obviously they shouldnt remove religion because people like u have no idea
 

P.T.F.E

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tommykins said:
Don't waste your time on that PTFE retard. Her posts in the Math section already has demonstrated her retardation and attempt to appear intellectually superior failing at epic proportions.

PS. whats the links to the blogs you read again? thanks :eek:
haha lol u crack me up
 

Kwayera

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tommykins said:
Don't waste your time on that PTFE retard. Her posts in the Math section already has demonstrated her retardation and attempt to appear intellectually superior failing at epic proportions.

PS. whats the links to the blogs you read again? thanks :eek:
Friendly Atheist
Pharyngula

:D
 

Kwayera

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P.T.F.E said:
i have noo idea
u are soo smart
i should listen to u about my own religion
Well, yes, because apparently I know more about it than you do. :rolleyes:

U clebrating christmas this year
do u know y
because all u have is pathetic facts
about ancient whatever
I celebrate Christmas for what it always has been - a time of giving. Can't let the pagans have all the fun.

URS are correct and mine are wrong
Yep.
 

P.T.F.E

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well at least im not like 21 and argueing with a 16 yr old about religion
sad in my opinion
i think u missed my tone in my previous posts but meh
an that is exactly what christmas is about, giving.

i was just saying that most think of Christmas as a time of gettin pressies
and its sad that they don't even think of Christ or giving.
i dont like forcing beliefs on people hence y (bak to topic) schools should drop religious teachings in PRIMARY SCHOOL in high school we should be taught about a varity of religions, and the meaning of holidays adopted by western culture even if it is in an atheist way.

i am not tryin to be smart like tommykins said and to be abused for th rest of my time on Bos cause i made one mistake on a mahs forum

i love to discuss and i am interested in what others have to say, i also enjoy debating my point but if thats goin to leave me abused and to some degree cut.\

SORRY
 

Prosper

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Christianity is definitely reducing in numbers - its only so long before more read excellent works such as The God Delusion and begin to realise that what they are being spoon fed (many Christians are indoctrinated) is complete trash and when they think about it realise that it really doesn't make sense. Islam is really a militarised take on religion, killing anyone who does not follow their story is a bit too much.
 

Kwayera

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P.T.F.E said:
well at least im not like 21 and argueing with a 16 yr old about religion
sad in my opinion
Why?

i think u missed my tone in my previous posts but meh
an that is exactly what christmas is about, giving.

i was just saying that most think of Christmas as a time of gettin pressies
and its sad that they don't even think of Christ or giving.
But that's the whole point. Christmas (despite the name) is not just about Christ. Of course many people don't "even think about Christ". Stop saying that like it's a bad thing! :p

i dont like forcing beliefs on people hence y (bak to topic) schools should drop religious teachings in PRIMARY SCHOOL in high school we should be taught about a varity of religions, and the meaning of holidays adopted by western culture even if it is in an atheist way.
And that is exactly what this course is trying to accomplish. It is not replacing religious courses; it's complementing them.

i am not tryin to be smart like tommykins said and to be abused for th rest of my time on Bos cause i made one mistake on a mahs forum

i love to discuss and i am interested in what others have to say, i also enjoy debating my point but if thats goin to leave me abused and to some degree cut.\

SORRY
It may assist your case if you made an attempt at speaking to people properly. Using "y" and not spellchecking does not give people a lot of confidence that you respect their viewpoint and discussions as much as you expect us to respect yours.
 
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Iron said:
That's how I roll? Fast and loose with the troof brau. You, youre more a sniper in the corner, shooting accurately from the shadows infrequently. Someone like Kfunk is a general launching a steady, well-planned invasion from time to time.
I'm glad we've established this :)

Because you expressly deny an ultimate truth? An ultimate reason for your existence?
I expressly deny that an ultimate truth is imposed by a magical man in the sky. Why can people not give their own lives meaning? I'd also add to this that I don't believe in the complete relativisation of morality - individuals can productively engage in discussion about the quality of their moral beliefs. Such discussions (for me) treat the good of individuals and society as the end to be consciously sought. Why can this not be an ultimate reason for my existence?

How can political views on freedom even scratch the surface of such questions? You certainly wouldnt believe that you were put on this earth to reduce the size of government.
I agree with you that a political project based upon the pursuit of negative liberty is quite limited. "Freeing" people from state intervention and then leaving them to die in the gutter is not a good thing. But I would say that, at the end of the day, both libertarians and social democrats are pursuing some conception of the "good society" that promotes individual and social well-being (happiness). Again, can't the good of mankind be an ultimate end?

If youre honest, youd admit that the only value of your life without fundamental foundation is the false quest to build up your own power and convince others of its truth - to construct your own reality, rather than pay heed to an objective one
What substantively do I do that makes you think my politics is about the domination of others. Sure, I try and convince people that I think my views are correct, but so do you, and I am willing to change my mind about things if a better argument comes along. How is this an intrinsically more dominating, megalomanical approach than your quest to fix values along the lines constructed by social conservatives in the United States during the late 1970s/early 1980s?
 

hermand

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Iron said:
Look, no one believes that a child is going to be a life-long convert if you give them a few neutral lessons about the concept of God. An entire Catholic schooling is dicey enough in terms of retaining believers. But these are deep philosophical questions. It would be a disgrace if our public education system whimped out on genuinely discussing the meaning of life, even in broad terms. Not everyone goes to uni - for many kids, this may be the only opp theyll have to be safely introduced to material of the upmost importance to the type of life theyll lead
yes. those "few" lessons are completely neutral.
:haha:

it's not as if they actually teach us about religion. they tell the class what they should believe and that's it. they don't teach you about the different beliefs in the world as the teachers consider themselves right, and that's that.

so either allow the classes to show the children different points of view rather than brainwashing them into being told that this is the way you should think, or just cut it all out. these are public schools. parent's don't send their kids there to learn about religion. if they wanted to, they'd send them to a religious school.

also, why do the people who don't want religion in their lives have to suffer by having other people like you tell them how they should be acting, what they should believe, and things like 'there's no meaning in life without god'. that's just ridiculous.

and it's been said that people don't understand how others can live without god. it's easy. just look at the scientific evidence around you. it's pretty clear that it's unlikely that any form of supernatural force/power, eg. god, exists. sorry to put it out there.
 

P.T.F.E

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science has proven a lot of things, in schools they just need something thats thoughtprovoking like meditation so they can make their own minds up, parents can shove religion down the throats then or send them to a religious school.

does science prove everything?
 

P.T.F.E

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Prosper said:
Islam is really a militarised take on religion, killing anyone who does not follow their story is a bit too much.
a tad sterotypical
 

Prosper

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P.T.F.E said:
a tad sterotypical
Yes I'm stereotyping a religion based on what their sacred text (the Qu'ran) says, what a racist/jerk/whatever I am!
 

P.T.F.E

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Prosper said:
Yes I'm stereotyping a religion based on what their sacred text (the Qu'ran) says, what a racist/jerk/whatever I am!
ok so my muslim friends are secretly trying to kill me cause im not part of their religion
 

boris

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P.T.F.E said:
science has proven a lot of things, in schools they just need something thats thoughtprovoking like meditation so they can make their own minds up, parents can shove religion down the throats then or send them to a religious school.

does science prove everything?
Does religion prove anything?
 

sdent40

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boris said:
Does religion prove anything?
religion doesn't need to prove anything, it is up to the non believers to go around and disprove every religion first
 

sjr90

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Iron: "This is what happens when we entrust left-wing kids with low uais to be the guardians of truth and knowledge"

This disgusts me. How can you actually think you're more righteous than anyone else here if you spread such hate?

The VIC education system are not denying the existence of God. They're saying there's no proof. They're teaching facts. Given that there are people alive today who undertake Christian religious practices I'd say it's obvious that faith is involved - I'm sure that's the answer Victorian school teachers will give when a curious student asks why so many people believe in something without material proof.

I think the most important step Australians can take to move our country toward one in which everyone - children, specifically - have freedom of religion is to properly explain National holidays to children. For instance:

"What is Christmas?"
"Well, Christians believe that a man, named Jesus, came down from heaven and died so that humans could live. Christmas is a Chirstian celebration of the birth of Jesus, and as our country has Christian roots we celebrate it as a nation, though for people who are not religious it is more a celebration of family and love."

This is how things are, in reality. If people can be educated about religion without being pushed into or away from particular religions, we all win. People accept each other and we can coexist. Ideally, our national holidays would be Australia Day and New Year's, leaving religious people free to celebrate their own sacred events, of course. However, our country's roots and the sentimental, somewhat biased nature of our government (and citizenship) forbid this.

Call me a hippie, call me left wing, attempt to insult me, Iron. I don't care. Come back to the whole of reality, not just the internet, and accept that not everyone shares your beliefs and are not of lesser moral standard than you are. Children have ample opportunity to learn about religion outside school, and just as church and state should be separate in a functional government, religion has no place in the public education system.

...once all the states follow Victoria's lead, perhaps we'll be able to give marriage back to the church and civil unions can become the standard. Everyone deserves the right to love - but that's another argument for another day, i guess.

For now, spread the love. Stop hating.
 

tommykins

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sdent40 said:
religion doesn't need to prove anything, it is up to the non believers to go around and disprove every religion first
Can't prove negative.

Try again.
 

sdent40

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tommykins said:
Can't prove negative.

Try again.
but god is invisible, non-corporeal, doesn't emit any heat/cold, completely mute, emits no radiation, resides in another dimension and exists outside of time!
 

tommykins

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sdent40 said:
but god is invisible, non-corporeal, doesn't emit any heat/cold, completely mute, emits no radiation, resides in another dimension and exists outside of time!
ie. doesn't exist?
 

Will Shakespear

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we should tell kids that religion and santa claus are make believe stories, like fairy tales

they're fun to read/hear about, but you have to remember they never happened in real life

sometimes ppl will tell you about these things as though they were real, but u have to remember it's just a story, like when u watch tv or a movie and it seems real

jesus = jack & the beanstalk

etc.
 

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