Rudd will lose this election (2 Viewers)

[Lentern]

mate capitalism doesn't work if nobody is demanding anything........

Yes and there is no middle ground between completely unfettered greed and North Korean communism.

 

[scuba_steve2121]

Yes and there is no middle ground between completely unfettered greed and North Korean communism.

everybody is self interested or in other words greedy capitalism allows the best system for people to indulge in this. and what you don't think North Korea runs on greed?

 

[Debauchee]

The free market creates no jobs, all it creates is impoverishment, inequality and instability. Without government we would never have moved past farmers and carpenters.

oh god i feel so dumb


didn't realise this guy is a troll lol sorry guys I'm new here

 

[Slidey]

Yeah look I'm all for non-market based government services like roads, police, healthcare, but you can't with a straight face say the free market should be abolished in other areas. Take banks for example. We COULD have state-owned banks, but what would be the point? They wouldn't operate any more efficiently and would be at a real risk of operating less efficiently with no tangible gain to consumers.

I just don't get where you're coming from with this poverty angle, Lentern. Australia doesn't have any real endemic poverty - we're an amazingly well-off country with amazingly good government services to buffer our extensive free market. I hate to say it, but if you're in poverty in Australia then it's not the government's fault, it's not the supermarket's fault, it's not the bank's fault. You've got access to public healthcare, public welfare, public housing, public education. Anybody who can't make their way in Australia has other issues (probably psychological) holding them back.

 

[scuba_steve2121]

oh god i feel so dumb


didn't realise this guy is a troll lol sorry guys I'm new here

nah dw man here we feed the trolls and see how stupid they can get

 

[Slidey]

oh god i feel so dumb


didn't realise this guy is a troll lol sorry guys I'm new here

It depends what day you catch him on.

 

[Lentern]

everybody is self interested or in other words greedy capitalism allows the best system for people to indulge in this. and what you don't think North Korea runs on greed?

No to all of it. People are fundamentally good, there is no greater motivation than the helping of others and greed is a mere poison that surfaces during times of unusual discomfort. NK runs on batshit insanity.

 

[Lentern]

Yeah look I'm all for non-market based government services like roads, police, healthcare, but you can't with a straight face say the free market should be abolished in other areas. Take banks for example. We COULD have state-owned banks, but what would be the point? They wouldn't operate any more efficiently and would be at a real risk of operating less efficiently with no tangible gain to consumers.

I just don't get where you're coming from with this poverty angle, Lentern. Australia doesn't have any real endemic poverty - we're an amazingly well-off country with amazingly good government services to buffer our extensive free market. I hate to say it, but if you're in poverty in Australia then it's not the government's fault, it's not the supermarket's fault, it's not the bank's fault. You've got access to public healthcare, public welfare, public housing, public education. Anybody who can't make their way in Australia has other issues (probably psychological) holding them back.

Much as I would like to see a little more put into public education and healthcare perhaps its not so much low income Australians I'd like to see the private healthcare subsidy going towards but vastly more desperate causes not confined to Australia.

 

[slugboy]

abbot will win because Rudd promised big things and he has either not implemented them or fucked them up

doing nothing is better than fucking everything up

Rudd himself hasn't fucked up, it's the civil servants (or whatever) who have failed to implement his plans properly i.e. putting such a short deadline on the school stimulus thing, which means that they (the builders) were forced to use pre-fabricated materials etc. in order to meet the deadlines.

 

[scuba_steve2121]

Rudd himself hasn't fucked up, it's the civil servants (or whatever) who have failed to implement his plans properly i.e. putting such a short deadline on the school stimulus thing, which means that they (the builders) were forced to use pre-fabricated materials etc. in order to meet the deadlines.

well that is a failure of government as a whole now isn't it?

 

[slugboy]

well that is a failure of government as a whole now isn't it?

yes, it a failure of the government and its workers, but not the rudd administration

 

[slugboy]

still, lets be glad that he didn't do the Tony Blair thing, and introduce a whole bunch of incredibly restrictive rules that cause untold misery for the general public (or whatever)

 

[scuba_steve2121]

yes, it a failure of the government and its workers, but not the Rudd administration

huh??

 

[slugboy]

to clarify, the civil servants, the people who run around advising MP's, quietly influencing the politicans, are in their nature conservative.

Since rudd is full of change and whatever, the civil service in trying to keep things the way they want it to be, deliberatly botch up the plans of rudd, i.e. basing the league tables on one unimportant test (NAPLAN) and forgetting anything about the SC and HSC.

 

[zombie omie jay]

Rudd himself hasn't fucked up, it's the civil servants (or whatever) who have failed to implement his plans properly i.e. putting such a short deadline on the school stimulus thing, which means that they (the builders) were forced to use pre-fabricated materials etc. in order to meet the deadlines.

do you even think about what you say

 

[zombie omie jay]

rudd's plan

his idea

his job to ensure it is implemented correctly

 

[bazrah]

to clarify, the civil servants, the people who run around advising MP's, quietly influencing the politicans, are in their nature conservative.

Since rudd is full of change and whatever, the civil service in trying to keep things the way they want it to be, deliberatly botch up the plans of rudd, i.e. basing the league tables on one unimportant test (NAPLAN) and forgetting anything about the SC and HSC.

It was Gillard pushing the NAPLAN tests and it was teachers fighting against it because they all hate the My School website so I'm not really sure what you mean with civil servants. People who do HSC and SC don't even have to do NAPLAN tests they are just used to test students under year 10. Trying to say the civil service is conservative and botching up Rudd's plans it just a silly scapegoat tactic. No wonder people can't see through Rudd's fake personality they can't even admit he's made big mistakes.

 

[Garygaz]

The problem with Tony Abbott is that he can criticize but he can't seem to offer anything constructive. I'm sure he has some good ideas but constantly bagging the government and having nothing to offer in reputing their policies looks bad.

also, he needs to stop saying 'big new tax'. makes him sound god damn illiterate.

 

[Lentern]

to clarify, the civil servants, the people who run around advising MP's, quietly influencing the politicans, are in their nature conservative.

Since rudd is full of change and whatever, the civil service in trying to keep things the way they want it to be, deliberatly botch up the plans of rudd, i.e. basing the league tables on one unimportant test (NAPLAN) and forgetting anything about the SC and HSC.

That sounds extraordinarily like an episode of Yes Prime Minister.

 

[slugboy]

That sounds extraordinarily like an episode of Yes Prime Minister.

it does doesn't it

@ zombie, i don't care what about what you say
go back to your beer