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Multiculturalism: who really gives a shit? (3 Viewers)

Lolsmith

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hahahaha

itt: privileged, uni educated white people who hang out with other uni educated people complain because the government is oppressing them

get out into the real world and see how much racism is really around, lol
They aren't complaining the government is oppressing them at all

What are you posting

The point of this discussion is not that there is racism but why the fuck are people not allowed to be racist? Being legally labelled a criminal because you said "a bunch of blacks cut off a woman's clitoris because they're barbaric monkeys" is so far beyond retarded. Especially when if any racial minority were to sling some racial slurs a white person's way, nothing would become of it. Everyone that you've criticised understands full well the extent of racism in this country, but just because they are well educated and associate with those that are of the same level of intelligence doesn't make them automatically ignorant to it
 

cosmo kramer

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making every behavior that people who yell racist consider racist illegal would prob put 95% of the (white) population in jail seriously

non-white ppl cant be racist as a rule they are reacting to white mistreatment
 

Chemical Ali

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They aren't complaining the government is oppressing them at all

What are you posting

The point of this discussion is not that there is racism but why the fuck are people not allowed to be racist? Being legally labelled a criminal because you said "a bunch of blacks cut off a woman's clitoris because they're barbaric monkeys" is so far beyond retarded. Especially when if any racial minority were to sling some racial slurs a white person's way, nothing would become of it. Everyone that you've criticised understands full well the extent of racism in this country, but just because they are well educated and associate with those that are of the same level of intelligence doesn't make them automatically ignorant to it
wat. this is what the law ACTUALLY says:

20C Racial vilification unlawful

(1) It is unlawful for a person, by a public act, to incite hatred towards, serious contempt for, or severe ridicule of, a person or group of persons on the ground of the race of the person or members of the group.

(2) Nothing in this section renders unlawful:

(a) a fair report of a public act referred to in subsection (1), or

(b) a communication or the distribution or dissemination of any matter on an occasion that would be subject to a defence of absolute privilege (whether under the Defamation Act 2005 or otherwise) in proceedings for defamation, or

(c) a public act, done reasonably and in good faith, for academic, artistic, scientific or research purposes or for other purposes in the public interest, including discussion or debate about and expositions of any act or matter.
I'm pretty sure the statement you made wouldn't count. It also doesn't say anything about excluding white people from protection but go ahead and make more baseless assumptions, lol
 

Lolsmith

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I'm pretty sure the statement you made wouldn't count.
Of course it fucking would because it's based on the race of the perpetrators and includes an insult that can be construed as a racial slur. That legislation is all far too open to manipulation anyway because some person's "severe ridicule of" is another's "fair report".

It also doesn't say anything about excluding white people from protection but go ahead and make more baseless assumptions, lol
The law is only acted upon if people desire it so and only if someone's willing to enforce it for whatever reason. People wouldn't get fined if the police didn't bother to give them out. No officer or lawyer would take up a case of racial vilification against a white person because the general perception is that the white man is a villain, not a victim. The opposite can be said for minorities. Tell me if this isn't the truth in your "real world".
 

Chemical Ali

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No it wouldn't because it has to go further and be shown that the statement was intended to incite.

Yeah keep making statements with no evidence at all, lol. IT'S THE GENERAL PERCEPTION. or maybe the vibe.
 

cosmo kramer

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serious contempt for, or severe ridicule of, a person or group of persons on the ground of the race of the person or members of the group.

a bunch of blacks cut off a woman's clitoris because they're barbaric monkeys

severe ridicule of

barbaric monkeys

yeah sorry that could be construed as 'severe ridicule' to me

the thing is tho these laws are pretty vague so i can see a lot of cases going to trial and the people accused getting off the indictment because theres a lot of wiggle room with these definitions

hate laws are retarded you dont even nede to prove that what people say actually incited any 'hatred' at all

just the fact that they COULD HAVE incited hatred is enough in the laws
 
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cosmo kramer

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but if we still had a 'white australia' policy we would quickly find a lot of countries would be unwilling to do business with us, see apartheid south africa
it wont be long before nobody will trade with south africa again but b/c south africa will have nothing to trade (because negro rule is returning it to the stone age pretty quickly)
 
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Rothbard

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If she is then reprimanded in someway though, isn't that infringing free speech, invoking some nonsense about a "right not to be offended" and all that other conse-I mean libertarian nonsense?
Public sphere vs private sphere are you so fundamentally fucking retarded you can't see the difference?

Lose your job for that kind of behaviour != go to prison

You retarded ignorant fuckstick
 

Rothbard

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No it wouldn't because it has to go further and be shown that the statement was intended to incite.

Yeah keep making statements with no evidence at all, lol. IT'S THE GENERAL PERCEPTION. or maybe the vibe.
No the problem is that you make certain combinations of words illegal and punishable by being kidnapped and imprisoned by the state.
 

Lentern

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Public sphere vs private sphere are you so fundamentally fucking retarded you can't see the difference?

Lose your job for that kind of behaviour != go to prison

You retarded ignorant fuckstick
You're still evading the question; many places wouldn't have these company procedures in place if it weren't for government regulations.
What is it with "libertarians" and just shouting down abuse at anyone who disagrees with them?


Edit: Also, Triple J radio, kind of blurring the private/public sphere lines a bit there.
 

Chemical Ali

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change of pace from talking about discrimination laws...

do you agree with Cory Bernadi's rant about muslims and why:

SENATOR BERNARDI ON MULTICULTUALISM:
Radio Interview 1137: 16th Feb 2011.
(Interviewer (I)) What is missing in this country (Australia) are politicians not frighten to speak their mind and the truth, and all too often our leaders run and duck for cover at the mere sniff of a tough issue and usually based on what the political correct brigade think is right and is wrong, and I think it is wrong to do that. I think it is disgraceful. You have got to say what you believe to be the truth, and this week it has been multiculturalism.
People are legitimately asking questions. They want to know why is our government is paying for the refugee funerals? Yes they feel for the families involved but as they do feel for families who have been involved in other natural disasters, and we have had the death of so many caused by the inland tsunami, the floods and even the cyclone.
They want to know why our immigration policy of bringing people to Australia, some who quite frankly don’t want to assimilate or integrate. They want to know why our government is fostering this multicultural industry paid for by the taxpayer, which is effectively segregating our community.
Multiculturalism is in trouble because it has become a code word for ‘open slather’, ‘carte blanche.’ We are not tough on immigration and we are breeding an entire generation relying on government support to foster self-interest.
And as I said yesterday, we have achieved real multiculturalism in this country before Al Grasby’s policy of multiculturalism. Back in those days we had post war migrants, Greeks, Italians, Lebanese, Maltese and cultures from all over the world. There was no government ‘drip feed’. These were people sent and looking for a better way of life; people who were inspired by the freedom Australia offered, and they wanted to be part of it, they embraced it. What happened to that idea?
Well there is one person who has some political ticker. They may have muzzled Scott Morrison, but they haven’t muzzled South Australian Liberal Senator Cory Bernadi. And today, I believe that he has touched a cord with everyday Australians.
(I) Good afternoon Senator.
(S) Good afternoon Chris.
(I) You have called for a crack down, I guess, on migrants who refuse to integrate?
(S) Well, I just want to see Australia in the future that is going to be cohesive and united as it has been in decades past. You know, over the last decades or two we have seen an increasing number of people whose allegiance is to ethnic hatred or their ideological baggage or their tribal history rather than to the value that Australia has founded, that is, the rule of law, the equality between genders, the equal opportunity for every body, and a fair go.
(I) I actually believe the greatest mix match has been our Christian values in this country, and what I see as an ‘Ancient Muslim Tribalism’. Now many other people wouldn’t pick out the Islamic religion as something that doesn’t fit with multiculturalism.
But I think there are parts of that community who have ancient tribalism that they continue to espouse, that is, there is no such thing as equal sexes, my religion is far superior to your laws, and democracy should be taken over by Sharia law.
And the more we have of these people the (more) younger members of their community will be influenced, and the more dramas we have with multiculturalism for it.
(S) Oh! Chris, you are spot on, but Islam itself is the problem, it is not Muslims. Muslims are individuals who practice their faith in their own way. But Islam is a totalitarianism, political and religious ideology. It tells people everything about how they should need to conduct themselves, who they are allow to marry, and how they are allowed to treat other people.
It has not moved on since it was founded and there are these extremist that want to see fundamentalist Islamic rule implemented in this country. They are continually trying to change our laws, they are seeking special accommodation to indulge in it, and unfortunately this government is allowing them and encouraging them to get away with it.
(I) Well, the Senator department and the Anti Racism department says to me ‘that we won’t be confronting what are clearly issues in our society related to multiculturalism, we will just try as much as we can to shut up people who want to, you know, to constructively argue the point of immigration.
(S) Well Chris, the speech by the Minister for Immigration the other night was an unbelievable admission of failure. He said on one hand that Multiculturalism is not failing and yet, on the other hand, they have set up a new range of bureaucracy to deal with racism and multiculturalism, and that’s clearly identified that there is a problem with it.
But this is a government that is in denial over so many of their policy failures. I mean we can recall when they said ‘pink batts’ were a good idea, and green loans were a good idea, and the mining tax is a good and the ETX?, all of these things that they refused to accept public opinion on, and this is another one.
The unfortunate part about this is that whilst we can always fix the balance sheet given enough time, you cannot fix a culture balance sheet when the excesses have gone too far.
(I) So you are you suggesting it’s an Islamic importation that we need to stop, per se, across the board?
(S) No. I don’t think that’s the case, but we should have an open migration policy, I believe in that and I think Australia’s had a great success at it. But what’s happened in the last decade or two has been an increasing indulgence of people who are pursuing an ideology and value system that is at complete odds with Western society and Western culture, and the political correctness brigade, as you described it, has stifled this.
Every time you say ‘I’m against Islamization of Australia or against Islam, which I do not support Islam, then I’m called a racist or a bigot and yet there are thousands, tens of thousands of Australians who feel they have been shut down from having their views expressed by a tiny minority of people who are seeking to upend our traditions in this country.
(I) Has the leader of your party, Tony Abbot, tried to stop you from espousing these views this afternoon?
(S) Well, no he certainly hasn’t.
(I) Has he been in contact with you?
(S) I’ve been in contact with Tony. I mean I am his party’s secretary, but my colleagues understand that I feel very strongly about this. I feel very strongly in favour of the…
(I) Yes, that’s great, but you know what’s happened to Scott Morrison, he has been successfully muzzled.
(S) Well, he’s been attacked, I think, most unfairly by the Labour Party who have sought to misconstrue Scott’s genuine concern about the Australian future we’re going to have…
(I) The Liberals could have toughen up Corey
(S) Well, you know…
(I) They’ve gone to water! - Apart from you.
(S) Well, I don’t think that’s the case. There are many people who share these concerns on behalf of the Australian people, and you know I feel very comfortable in speaking out about it, because I have been for it some time and I’m not cowered by the threats and the intimidations that I receive…
(I) So it boils down to this. Come to this country, be willing to work hard because that is our tradition, that is our culture here, have a great time, enjoy yourself, be funny, take the Mickey out of each other because that is very Australian as well, but make sure you do it under the umbrella of an Australian life-style.
We want to see your culture, we want to experience some of your culture, no problem, but come with us, embrace the country, don’t put your hand out and more than that don’t think that your religion is bigger than the Australian law.
(S) Well Chris, that is exactly right. My father came to Australia from Italy fifty years ago, my wife is a migrant, I’ve got cousins and relations have come from all different parts of the world, and they came to Australia because it offers them opportunity and freedom, and it gives them every chance to make a success.
None of them has sought to change Australia, they’ve sought to add to our cultural enrichment by bringing some of what their traditions are but making sure it is consistent with Australian values and laws. And that’s what’s made Australia so good.
So why are we encouraging separation or isolation? Why are we encouraging people who pursue hate speech against…who want to use the freedom that we have against us? And that I think is a real problem.
And we need to imagine what sort of country we want to be in twenty years time or thirty years time, and if we are not careful now, if we don’t put a stop to it now we’re going to end up like England or France or Belgium or the Nederlands or Western Europe where they have a problem much too difficult for them to cope with?
(I) A chronic problem – almost the first signs of civil war – that’s what they have! Can I ask you one question? Therefore, do you support the Federal government’s payment of funeral expenses related to those connected to the tragedy on Christmas Island?
(S) I think it is the wrong thing to do. It sends a very bad message to the taxpayers of Australia, that’s a personal view. I also accept that there are some sensitivities about this and there are political constraints in voicing when you should say these things.
But in the feedback I get right around Australia is that, you know, why are we doing this encouraging people to come to this country illegally and then accommodating them for all their excesses.
Now this is a genuine problem for many Australians and the fact that every time you want to have a discussion about it the Labour Party and some of the extreme left movement come out and try to power people down and call them names is a problem, but we have to overcome that.
(I) Don’t be muzzled, will you.
(S) Oh, no I won’t and the people who know me recognize I’m nothing if not consistent when it comes to these messages.
(I) Thank you for your time this afternoon. (S) It’s a pleasure.
 

mirakon

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change of pace from talking about discrimination laws...

do you agree with Cory Bernadi's rant about muslims and why:
no i don't but making it illegal for him to say so is ridiculously stupid and inhibitory of the principles of free speech
 

Rothbard

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What is it with "libertarians" and just shouting down abuse at anyone who disagrees with them?
Because you want to make certain combinations of words illegal, an action, which to me is as abhorrent as orchestrated book burnings.

To your initial point it doesn't seem entirely relevant. Some businesses will have some practices, others won't. We'll see how they deal with scrutiny. One size fits all legislation is never the answer.

Stop trying this thought-police bullshit, it's riduclous. Allow people to have free and frank discussions, homophobia and racism will be exposed as the intellectual fraud that they are.
 

Lentern

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Because you want to make certain combinations of words illegal, an action, which to me is as abhorrent as orchestrated book burnings.

To your initial point it doesn't seem entirely relevant. Some businesses will have some practices, others won't. We'll see how they deal with scrutiny. One size fits all legislation is never the answer.

Stop trying this thought-police bullshit, it's riduclous. Allow people to have free and frank discussions, homophobia and racism will be exposed as the intellectual fraud that they are.
Invert the story slightly, Maclean doesn't make a complaint because there is no avenue to do so, is this a good thing?
 

Rothbard

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Invert the story slightly, Maclean doesn't make a complaint because there is no avenue to do so, is this a good thing?
You can be executed for being a gay in Iran.

Don't be gay in Iran.
 

Rothbard

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If there's no process to do so, get a new job or go to the media or write on a blog.
 

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