Imams condone rape, violence right here in Australia (3 Viewers)

[King.BBjames]

Thank you for your educated response. If you have a box of apples and one apple is rotten it doesn't mean the whole box is rotten. No muslim women would accept her husband marrying more than 1 women!

that's a very uneducated post. i don't know what your ethnic background is but in the sub continent and south east Asia it is very rare for a husband to have more than 1 wife. just as its rare to find it in western Europe or across the Atlantic in the Americas. however, the same cannot be said about the middle east/arab countries. it is very common in gulf states for a man to have numerous wife's. its a norm. In fact, its encouraged by the social structure of gulf societies.

 

[yld]

1. No one in this thread has said that ALL muslims are terrorists. This thread is about criticising the horrible treatment of women that is condoned by Islamic scripture and by the Imams that represent the Muslim community. To criticise is NOT being racist or Islamophobic. That is why Islam is so dangerous and is struggling to modernise today. When anyone dares to say “Look, the way you are practising your religion is cruel to women, or is making people bomb buildings, DO something to improve your religion”, they are automatically labelled as a racist. Also, Nazis were NOT Christians! Nazism was its own belief system.

2. Just because Islam is a “fast growing” religion, does NOT mean it is true. In the 1930s Germany, Nazism was the fastest growing political belief, but it doesn’t mean “there must be something there that is right” in Nazi ideology

3. In Sharia law, what is the punishment for apostasy?

4. ISLAM IS NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE. Read the Koran.
Again, what is the punishment for Apostasy? (death).
What is the prize you get in heaven for killing an infidel? (72 virgins).
What is an infidel? (ANYONE who is not a muslim).

The Koran (and the Bible) demand that homosexuals and women who have sex before marriage be stoned to death. There are fabulous long passages describing the hell that awaits infidels in the Koran. The Koran also explicitly states that a woman’s testimony is worth half of a man’s testimony. Also women are expected to be sexually available to their husbands at ALL times. They do not get a choice. This is rape within marriage. Bin Laden’s messages and threats after 9/11 were taken, unaltered from the Koran. Need I go on? Islam only requires that muslims be peaceful with other muslims (only male muslims at that), and insists on INTOLERANCE towards infidels.

Lastly, look at the Bombings in London. They were planned and carried out by upper middle class Muslim doctors and engineers. “Culture” or “Socioeconomic” factors did not influence them. Islam was the sole motivator

As a moderate Muslims, it is up to you to change and modernise your religion for the better. Do not ignore the problems with Islam, or pretend they do not exist. Do not say, “It is only a tiny, tiny minority of muslims who are extreme”. Deal with the problem! The subject of this thread is an excellent opportunity!!! We have yet to see a muslim replying to this thread who has said:

"Those Imams who are encouraging the degradation of women are wrong, they should apologise or resign”.


Salem.

yes i understand where you are coming from; and what you have mentioned about apostasy was properly true and stated in the koran but because the koran is formed around revelations during the prophet's life its content is from times of war at some parts where killing of non-muslims was okay because at that time they were the enemy. And yes it is the tiny-minority of so called muslims who are extremist but doesnt mean a majority are; im not; nor is anyone i know. and yes true those imams are wrong; they shouldnt be encouraging the degradation of women because it is wrong and is not islam when islam has set very strict guidelines towards how woman are treated. those should apologise to all the people they are teaching because such nonsense should not be taught.

theres alot about islam which may seem as a problem today but they came at a certain time for a certain reason. and im sorry to say, islam is not a religion to be changed so that it fits the mordenised world. if it was to then i as mondernised person would be the creater; not god. mondernisation of a religion is the not the true religion itself; it would be altered and changed and true religion would be lost.


tc.x

 

[yld]

well if your atheist stop with your nonesense about other religions... its non of your business... If you have something constructive and valuable with evidence supporting your claim then go ahead... otherwise just shut up and stop bombarding all the hate Islam/Gazza/religion threads.

Side note: I suggest that no one replies to John Oliver as he isn't worth anyone's time and just ignore him... his still in primary school.

i definitely agree with you;
john oliver is very arrogant; here he is trying to spread hatred and yet he is having a cry about islam is all about hate. kinda hypocritical isnt it.
btw john oliver you still have not replied to me. what was so wrong with the life of prophet mohammad?

 

[yld]

that's a very uneducated post. i don't know what your ethnic background is but in the sub continent and south east Asia it is very rare for a husband to have more than 1 wife. just as its rare to find it in western Europe or across the Atlantic in the Americas. however, the same cannot be said about the middle east/arab countries. it is very common in gulf states for a man to have numerous wife's. its a norm. In fact, its encouraged by the social structure of gulf societies.

true but that is a issue build over centuries. its part of the arab culture although it is not accepted by any religion including islam (you would need your first wife's permission and no woman is idoitic to give permission)

 

[Edu.kid]

Where the fteet do people get that muslims get 72 virgins when they die. The virgins are representative of angels who will serve you when you got to heavan. The term virgin is used to signify the purity of the angels. The Koran is very metaphorical and is almost like poetry for those who actually know it. No way in hell do u get 72 virgins of the other kind.

Secondly the koran explicitly states that we must respect the people of the book being jews and christians. Additionally during times of war if an enemy or opposing member visited u we must treat them with the utmost respect and graceful greetings as any other.

The koran allows a man to marry more than one women only with the consent of his first wife in certain cirumstances. SUch as a widow who lost her husband and is incapable of fending for herself not for our own sexual greed. I have been to the gulf before and have never seen a husband with more than one wife or any other muslims living in Australia. This action was common in past when women relied on men as the bread winners of the family, but times have changed.

 

[Rockaleee]

Where the fteet do people get that muslims get 72 virgins when they die. The virgins are representative of angels who will serve you when you got to heavan. The term virgin is used to signify the purity of the angels. The Koran is very metaphorical and is almost like poetry for those who actually know it. No way in hell do u get 72 virgins of the other kind.

Secondly the koran explicitly states that we must respect the people of the book being jews and christians. Additionally during times of war if an enemy or opposing member visited u we must treat them with the utmost respect and graceful greetings as any other.

From Sura Verse29:

9.29: Fight those who do not believe in Allah, noe ub the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgement of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

9.37: O Prophet! strive hard [make war] against the unbelievers and the hypocrites and be unyielding to them; and their abode is hell, and evil is the destination.

It's YOUR book, read it. And if you don't like it, leave it and stop imposing your 7th century morality on the rest of us.

 

[Rockaleee]

yes i understand where you are coming from; and what you have mentioned about apostasy was properly true and stated in the koran but because the koran is formed around revelations during the prophet's life its content is from times of war at some parts where killing of non-muslims was okay because at that time they were the enemy. And yes it is the tiny-minority of so called muslims who are extremist but doesnt mean a majority are; im not; nor is anyone i know. and yes true those imams are wrong; they shouldnt be encouraging the degradation of women because it is wrong and is not islam when islam has set very strict guidelines towards how woman are treated. those should apologise to all the people they are teaching because such nonsense should not be taught.

theres alot about islam which may seem as a problem today but they came at a certain time for a certain reason. and im sorry to say, islam is not a religion to be changed so that it fits the mordenised world. if it was to then i as mondernised person would be the creater; not god. mondernisation of a religion is the not the true religion itself; it would be altered and changed and true religion would be lost.


tc.x

I am glad that you agree that Imams that make derogatory remarks against women should apologise or resign. Now please discuss this with you Muslim friends and family and work to kick out these backward beliefs from the Australian Muslim community. If most Australian muslims are moderates, please elect a representative who truly relflects the majority of the Muslim community.

If the practice of Islam cannot be modernised, then it should be abandoned.
The Chrisitan church has been forced to modernise (a BIT! bUT STILL HAS A LONG WAY TO GO!!!) But at least they don't condone stoning people to death anymore. Nor do they say slavery is allowed, as they did before the early 20th century. Islam TOO must modernise its 7th century form of "morality" or the lives of millions will be worser for it.

Clearly, the most reasonable thing to do would become an atheist. You will not have to justify a morally insuffiecient scripture against modern decency and common sense.

Surely, if Allah was an eternal, all-foreseeing god, he would have provided a scripture that would be relevant for all time, not just for peasant-warriors in the 7th century.

 

[King.BBjames]

if you been following john olivers/nolans posts through all his accounts you should be able to pick up when he is trolling and when he isnt.

 

[yld]

I am glad that you agree that Imams that make derogatory remarks against women should apologise or resign. Now please discuss this with you Muslim friends and family and work to kick out these backward beliefs from the Australian Muslim community. If most Australian muslims are moderates, please elect a representative who truly relflects the majority of the Muslim community.

If the practice of Islam cannot be modernised, then it should be abandoned.
The Chrisitan church has been forced to modernise (a BIT! bUT STILL HAS A LONG WAY TO GO!!!) But at least they don't condone stoning people to death anymore. Nor do they say slavery is allowed, as they did before the early 20th century. Islam TOO must modernise its 7th century form of "morality" or the lives of millions will be worser for it.

Clearly, the most reasonable thing to do would become an atheist. You will not have to justify a morally insuffiecient scripture against modern decency and common sense.




Surely, if Allah was an eternal, all-foreseeing god, he would have provided a scripture that would be relevant for all time, not just for peasant-warriors in the 7th century.

true true. The Chrisitan church has been forced to modernise therefore the real thruth and the real chrisitianity is lost; take christmas 4 example its more about gifts than the birth of jesus. And honestly Allah is an eternal, all-foreseeing god. there is so much in islam which is relevant to all times; the koran is very metaphorical therefore hard 2 understand but there is so much information about the universe that is stated in the koran before some scientist discovered. if islam was to change its religion where would its originaltly. it may seem 2 need to mordenise to the western world because soceity here (western) has changed so much and has gone totally a different direction to islam and christianity itself. islam not changing shows that it is very accurate and reliable and original. islam is not about whats going on the world today but inthe hereafter (heaven or hell); life is a test to us muslims and those are the guidelines we have to follow.

 

[Rockaleee]

Where the fteet do people get that muslims get 72 virgins when they die. The virgins are representative of angels who will serve you when you got to heavan. The term virgin is used to signify the purity of the angels. The Koran is very metaphorical and is almost like poetry for those who actually know it. No way in hell do u get 72 virgins of the other kind.

The Koran states that you are not allowed to "re-interpret" its writings, such as saying "Oh, the 72 virgins are only a metaphorical representation of angels". If you say that, you are an a infidel, according to your own scripture. So 72 virgins it is .

 

[King.BBjames]

true but that is a issue build over centuries. its part of the arab culture although it is not accepted by any religion including islam (you would need your first wife's permission and no woman is idoitic to give permission)

you just contradicted yourself. on one hand you sympathize with the Arabs because its "culture" on the other hand you say Islam does not allow it and "no woman would approve of such an act". the truth is ISLAM does approve a man to marry up to 4 woman at a time under certain circumstances. however its not practiced outside gulf states and it ABUSED inside gulf states.

 

[Rockaleee]

true true. The Chrisitan church has been forced to modernise therefore the real thruth and the real chrisitianity is lost; take christmas 4 example its more about gifts than the birth of jesus. And honestly Allah is an eternal, all-foreseeing god. there is so much in islam which is relevant to all times; the koran is very metaphorical therefore hard 2 understand but there is so much information about the universe that is stated in the koran before some scientist discovered. if islam was to change its religion where would its originaltly. it may seem 2 need to mordenise to the western world because soceity here (western) has changed so much and has gone totally a different direction to islam and christianity itself. islam not changing shows that it is very accurate and reliable and original. islam is not about whats going on the world today but inthe hereafter (heaven or hell); life is a test to us muslims and those are the guidelines we have to follow.

So, this is what you are really saying:

The teaching of Islam can never be changed to fit modern morality and ethics.
Muslims SHOULD STILL stone women to death for wearing revealing clothing or having premarital relations.
Allah is telling me to KILL homosexuals
Allah tells me to kill infidels(anyone who is not Muslim).
Allah tells me that women are worth half that of a man, and rape within marriage is allowable.
All this must not change.

 

[King.BBjames]

So, this is what you are really saying:

The teaching of Islam can never be changed to fit modern morality and ethics.
Muslims SHOULD STILL stone women to death for wearing revealing clothing or having premarital relations.
Allah is telling me to KILL homosexuals
Allah tells me to kill infidels(anyone who is not Muslim).
Allah tells me that women are worth half that of a man, and rape within marriage is allowable.
All this must not change.

HAHA!

listen, most of these practices are only performed when theocratic governments are in place.

 

[Rockaleee]

And these "theocratic governments" are the Sharia governments which many Muslims wish to establish in Western countries. This Sharia-ruled govt. is also the type that Hamas wants to replace Israel with.

 

[King.BBjames]

And these "theocratic governments" are the Sharia governments which many Muslims wish to establish in Western countries. This Sharia-ruled govt. is also the type that Hamas wants to replace Israel with.

HAHAHA. your either jsut stupid or fucking retarted skank.

i can grantee you my fucking life, if this imaginary "pure Islamic sharia" country ever existed on the face of this planet...all those jackasses who wish to turn western Europe into an Islamic state ( umm like a few hundered people i think) wouldnt even move to this so called magical place....but just criticize it for not being Islamic enough. like fucking c'mon, who would want to move to a country when they cut off your hands for stealing a loaf of bread or hang you for fucking another girl? WHO WOULD?

 

[yld]

So, this is what you are really saying:

The teaching of Islam can never be changed to fit modern morality and ethics.
Muslims SHOULD STILL stone women to death for wearing revealing clothing or having premarital relations.
Allah is telling me to KILL homosexuals
Allah tells me to kill infidels(anyone who is not Muslim).
Allah tells me that women are worth half that of a man, and rape within marriage is allowable.
All this must not change.

sorry about the misunderstanding. Islam is very complicating for a non-muslim.
Allah tells me to kill infidels(anyone who is not Muslim) - that fact is based during one of the wars during the prophets times; because the non muslims at the time were the muslims enemies. AND never ever in islam are women are worth half that of a man, and rape within marriage is allowable; EVER. women are considered the light of the family; the respect that is to be for a woman in islam exceeds. homosexuals are not accepted not only in islam but all religions; mordenised or not. And i have never heard of a woman being stoned to death for revealing clothing; that aspect of the sharia has many related rules and regulations which also are to be considered.


i must say that was a really well come back. but its very hard to understand other people's believes. i guess we just have to accepts other people's religion for the religion and not what people are acting like because humans can make mistakes. i honestly although a muslim respect every other religion and race because that is what i have been taught in a mosque by my imam because it is one the main parts of islam.

 

[Edu.kid]

So, this is what you are really saying:

The teaching of Islam can never be changed to fit modern morality and ethics.
Muslims SHOULD STILL stone women to death for wearing revealing clothing or having premarital relations.
Allah is telling me to KILL homosexuals
Allah tells me to kill infidels(anyone who is not Muslim).
Allah tells me that women are worth half that of a man, and rape within marriage is allowable.
All this must not change.

you just contradicted yourself, you told me that no-one can interpret the Koran and here you are.

 

[Edu.kid]

I am glad that you agree that Imams that make derogatory remarks against women should apologise or resign. Now please discuss this with you Muslim friends and family and work to kick out these backward beliefs from the Australian Muslim community. If most Australian muslims are moderates, please elect a representative who truly relflects the majority of the Muslim community.

If the practice of Islam cannot be modernised, then it should be abandoned.
The Chrisitan church has been forced to modernise (a BIT! bUT STILL HAS A LONG WAY TO GO!!!) But at least they don't condone stoning people to death anymore. Nor do they say slavery is allowed, as they did before the early 20th century. Islam TOO must modernise its 7th century form of "morality" or the lives of millions will be worser for it.

Clearly, the most reasonable thing to do would become an atheist. You will not have to justify a morally insuffiecient scripture against modern decency and common sense.

Surely, if Allah was an eternal, all-foreseeing god, he would have provided a scripture that would be relevant for all time, not just for peasant-warriors in the 7th century.

The koran is applicable throughout the ages. SInce when did the bible specify that in 2000 you will kill murderers with a bullet or laser gun in the year 3000. The Koran used the natural elements such as rocks as does the bible (which moses did) as the natural elements will continue to exist throughout time. How do muslims even elect an imam it seems like they elect themselves or someone else choses not the people. 99.5% of muslims are moderate mind you there are 1.2 billion.

 

[Edu.kid]

you just contradicted yourself. on one hand you sympathize with the Arabs because its "culture" on the other hand you say Islam does not allow it and "no woman would approve of such an act". the truth is ISLAM does approve a man to marry up to 4 woman at a time under certain circumstances. however its not practiced outside gulf states and it ABUSED inside gulf states.

Your right maybe some people in the gulf do abuse this idea, the same as cult leaders from other religions do the same and have multiple wives. Such an action is limited to a few.

 

[King.BBjames]

Your right maybe some people in the gulf do abuse this idea, the same as cult leaders from other religions do the same and have multiple wives. Such an action is limited to a few.

abuse limited to a few? yes.
but is multiple marriages the norm in gulf states. yes also.