Homosexuality in Australia (5 Viewers)

[proletariat]

That a gay person should never get to act on how they feel.

Why does this remind me of Frank Fitts from American Beauty?

 

[Name_Taken]

Like the right of people to be on the same footing as others? The right of gay people to be treated the same as straight, and be afforded the same rights?

What "rights" exactly of yours are those being violated?

 

[ClockworkSoldier]

Oh you are funny.

How can anyone enjoy a life without sex, oh the agony! It just doesn't bear thinking about.

How can one love another without having sex with them, its like totally not possible... Riiight...

It is hardly inhumane. I am not forcing anyone to do anything. Faith is a choice, and by extension, abstenence is a choice.

If a person who feels homosexual urges rightly accepts that having homosexual sex is a sin, and chooses to serve God rather than themselves, they will happily live a life of abstenence by their own choice. They should be praised and supported for their devotion and sacrifice.

Get some self control, there is more to life than sex buddy.

Don't twist my words.

I never said that, did I?

Simply, if you are homosexual, it is forbidden. You may argue that it is just the act of homosexual sex that is the sin, but infact I see most christians as viewing homosexuality as a sin itself.

Homosexual relationships are frowned upon no matter what, they are not respected. One of these relationships is inherently forbidden, so in esence you are denying them a true... Uninterupted, peaceful relationship where their love is allowed to flourish naturally.

Don't put words in my mouth, or ideals in my head just because you assume that that is how people 'not of the faith' think.

 

[Kwayera]

What "rights" exactly of yours are those being violated?

Mine in particular? None. I'm not gay. But that doesn't mean I can't passionately defend those that are, given that they are discriminated against in tax law, family law (adoption and marriage), etc etc. What kind of a world do we live in when a person cant visit their dying loved one in hospital because their relationship is on the officially sanctioned list of spouse or family?

 

[BlackDragon]

What "rights" exactly of yours are those being violated?

Why do we have to be fighting for our own rights? I cannot believe the stuff you are arguing, it is so terrible. (against people)

 

[Name_Taken]

I just can't believe people still have views like this. That a gay person should never get to act on how they feel. It is so scary that this is how you feel. Its just plain bigotry and discrimination. I bet if you told your parents about your views on gay people they would freak out.

Yea, becuase there is nothing that defines a person more than their sexual desires, and so telling anyone that some things are simply immoral is like totally denying them the ability to express their true self.

Lol @ parents, they'd prob freak out if they even knew I had a Bible in my bedroom.

 

[BlackDragon]

You are so awful.

 

[Will Shakespear]

Oh you are funny.

How can anyone enjoy a life without sex, oh the agony! It just doesn't bear thinking about.

How can one love another without having sex with them, its like totally not possible... Riiight...

It is hardly inhumane. I am not forcing anyone to do anything. Faith is a choice, and by extension, abstenence is a choice.

If a person who feels homosexual urges rightly accepts that having homosexual sex is a sin, and chooses to serve God rather than themselves, they will happily live a life of abstenence by their own choice. They should be praised and supported for their devotion and sacrifice.

Get some self control, there is more to life than sex buddy.

ok now this gets interesting, lol

of course it's possible to love someone without having sex with them. but part of the romantic type of love (eros) is usually the desire to have sex with that person as, idk, an expression of that love? (and it's fun)

so you'd propose maybe that homosexuals might have relationships in the romantic sense, but simply abstain from sex?

well, let's be graphic... can they kiss?
feel each other up?
touch cocks together?
i mean, when does the love stop and the sin start, lol?

and if they can kiss, what's so special about sex, i mean

why does the all-knowing creator of the universe care so much about cock-in-anus?

 

[Name_Taken]

Mine in particular? None. I'm not gay. But that doesn't mean I can't passionately defend those that are, given that they are discriminated against in tax law, family law (adoption and marriage), etc etc. What kind of a world do we live in when a person cant visit their dying loved one in hospital because their relationship is on the officially sanctioned list of spouse or family?

In the case of taxation law and some areas of family law I would conceed that some changes are in order (however certinly not in the cases of adoption or marriage).

And they can visit their loved ones in hospital, its other more obscure issues, like turning off life support and things like that, where the law needs to be adjusted.

I have nothing against the state recognising homosexual couples, and giving them equal rights under the law as heterosexual rights. However neither marriage nor adoption are rights.

 

[Kwayera]

In the case of taxation law and some areas of family law I would conceed that some changes are in order (however certinly not in the cases of adoption or marriage).

...

I have nothing against the state recognising homosexual couples, and giving them equal rights under the law as heterosexual rights. However neither marriage nor adoption are rights.

They are things available to one group of people and not another for an arbitrary reason (their sexuality). That makes it a discussion about discrimination, and therefore rights. People/a group do not have the right to be discriminated against by the state based on their gender, race, etc - why sexuality?

There's no reason to withhold marriage from gay couples save for one: offending the sensibilities of people like you. There's no reason to prevent a gay couple from adopting (in fact, lesbian couples on average do better at raising kids than do hetero couples), save for the same reason.

 

[TrueHappiness]

ok now this gets interesting, lol

of course it's possible to love someone without having sex with them. but part of the romantic type of love (eros) is usually the desire to have sex with that person as, idk, an expression of that love? (and it's fun)

so you'd propose maybe that homosexuals might have relationships in the romantic sense, but simply abstain from sex?

well, let's be graphic... can they kiss?
feel each other up?
touch cocks together?
i mean, when does the love stop and the sin start, lol?

and if they can kiss, what's so special about sex, i mean

why does the all-knowing creator of the universe care so much about cock-in-anus?

I think he was talking metaphorically, or hypothetically speaking. God made sex to be good, to be enjoyed and shared in marriage, between one man and women.

He is certainly stating that we should all LOVE one another, not romantically, but rather as the love we express to our brother or sister.

The question of romance between same sexed couples is well, no. The Church has never really touched upon this, but if the consideration is logical, then romance too should be shared between a man and women. Adam, expressed romance to Eve via the form of a love song, etc...

This however is just getting silly. Your method to shock and jest at our beliefs are quite idiotic and does not contribute anythign very benefical to the argument.

 

[BlackDragon]

This however is just getting silly. Your method to shock and jest at our beliefs are quite idiotic and does not contribute anythign very benefical to the argument.

This thread has been going on for a long time and all we are doing is fighting against discrimination.

 

[Will Shakespear]

I think he was talking metaphorically, or hypothetically speaking. God made sex to be good, to be enjoyed and shared in marriage, between one man and women.

He is certainly stating that we should all LOVE one another, not romantically, but rather as the love we express to our brother or sister.

The question of romance between same sexed couples is well, no. The Church has never really touched upon this, but if the consideration is logical, then romance too should be shared between a man and women. Adam, expressed romance to Eve via the form of a love song, etc...

This however is just getting silly. Your method to shock and jest at our beliefs are quite idiotic and does not contribute anythign very benefical to the argument.

Actually it's a perfectly good quesiton, just like the one about when did early hominids first get souls.

If you want to make up victimless sins like blasphemy or anal sex, you better have bloody good explanations for them. You're just used to religious claims being exempt from critical thinking

---

Actually it's interesting that both the bible and sodomy laws like the one in England only ever expliclty forbid male gay sex... further suggesting that the whole thing is not just human-made but man-made, none of them ever thought to ban lesbian sex, lol

 

[TrueHappiness]

Mine in particular? None. I'm not gay. But that doesn't mean I can't passionately defend those that are, given that they are discriminated against in tax law, family law (adoption and marriage), etc etc. What kind of a world do we live in when a person cant visit their dying loved one in hospital because their relationship is on the officially sanctioned list of spouse or family?

There is certainly a moral complication here. I dont really know how to answer this question. Certainly your arguments are just.

But the only thing I am sure of is that homsexuality is a sin, in the eyes of a Christian. We believe it is not to be encouraged in society, leading to eternal condemnation, and therefore, for the good of the society discourage it.

There perhaps may be another system that recognises gay couples and perhaps grant certain rights and so forth... But if we consider this in the picture of the eternal world, a few decades, is nothing compared to eternity.

Now you may believe this to be all bullshit and crticise me all you like. But that is our belief in the Church. And you can certainly change it, through political means. There is nothing stopping you. We may only provide arguements against. It is after all a God given free country.

 

[Name_Taken]

This thread has been going on for a long time and all we are doing is promoting evil.

Fixed.

 

[Name_Taken]

Actually it's interesting that both the bible and sodomy laws like the one in England only ever expliclty forbid male gay sex... further suggesting that the whole thing is not just human-made but man-made, none of them ever thought to ban lesbian sex, lol

Lolwut?

Romans: 1:26-27 - For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.

 

[TrueHappiness]

Actually it's a perfectly good quesiton, just like the one about when did early hominids first get souls.

If you want to make up victimless sins like blasphemy or anal sex, you better have bloody good explanations for them. You're just used to religious claims being exempt from critical thinking

Well, there is no sin against anal sex first of all, as long as it is within a marraige. Blasphemy certainly do. There are good reasons for that. First of all is that it inflames and cause tension. Take the example of say... that cartoon drawing of Mohammad. Observe the terrible catastrophe achieved.

Secondly, take the example of sex outside of marraige. To your claim, you could say, this has no negative impact upon society. However, how can you tell, via critical thinking alone. Such questions requires rigiorous scientific proof, and your guess is best as mine.

But further more, a sin does not have to have any impact upon society. Your confussing this with a common law, and rather the socical justice system. A system of laws that defines sins are set by God alone, a almight creator. This creator would certain do w/e he wants with the Earth, since he is the creator, setting w/e laws he wished. How can you question something beyond you?

 

[ClockworkSoldier]

Homosexuals expressing love = Evil. Love should therefore = Evil.

Them physically expressing love (sex) = Evil. Sex (in any context) should therefore = Evil.

Why must one group be segregated for eternity without the rest of the world? I've heard that christianity promotes equality.

Bullshit.

 

[TrueHappiness]

I think Shakespear, that although your writing proceeds you, shall we first research into Christianity before confussing the argument?

 

[Kwayera]

There is certainly a moral complication here. I dont really know how to answer this question. Certainly your arguments are just.

But the only thing I am sure of is that homsexuality is a sin, in the eyes of a Christian. We believe it is not to be encouraged in society, leading to eternal condemnation, and therefore, for the good of the society discourage it.

There perhaps may be another system that recognises gay couples and perhaps grant certain rights and so forth... But if we consider this in the picture of the eternal world, a few decades, is nothing compared to eternity.

Now you may believe this to be all bullshit and crticise me all you like. But that is our belief in the Church. And you can certainly change it, through political means. There is nothing stopping you. We may only provide arguements against. It is after all a God given free country.

That's great if you were living in a society if everybody was the same, believed in the same god and agreed with each other on every point. But this isn't. There are Christians and Muslims and Hindus and Buddhists and atheists and Pastafarians and god knows what else, all believing differently.

You are legislating that everyone bend to your way of believing. You believe it should be law that homosexuals can't marry (which, before you get started, predates your church and is NOT a religious thing everywhere, so don't even try the "marriage is religious" claptrap), can't adopt, can't be recognised as equal next to heterosexuals.

That's cool if you believe homosexuality is a sin. You're welcome not to do it yourself. But it becomes a problem when you try and force this on everybody else, which is why this thread exists, and why we get so mad at bigoted opinions like yours. They're fine if kept to one's self. But when you say "this gay couple, well, they don't even believe what I believe but who care's, they can't get married because my god doesn't like it and I SAY SO" - well, that's not really a valid argument, is it?

Nor is it fair.