HAY GUYS! The Unions are sick of small crowds (2 Viewers)

[Abu Ghurayb]

I wish that these arguments wouldn't ALWAYS end up a volly of personal or ideological attacks.

 

[katie_tully]

whatever morons you're the ones taking this to extremes

i merely pointed out that perhaps hasn't attended university before
maybe her opinion of unions would change if she went
when she expresses her opinion with such firmness when she hasn't been before it's just a little irritating is all

should i begin the lame stereotype attacks now?

Hahahaha. Shall we go through the ridiculous points in the USU argument now? Such as it's all one big plot to ruin lefties at university? Or that everybody who supports VOLUNTARY student unionism is SELFISH?

Even if I went to university, I'd get the same response. Already people have been attacking which university people go to. Apparently if you're not at USYD or UNSW, and you're a first year student, you have no basis for argument.

I'm going to CSU in Bathurst. Oh lordy, I doubt I'll be able to comment then...Oh, I'll also add that I'll be living away from home and that I would much prefer to keep my $600 for other living expenses, rather than supporting your social lives

 

[walrusbear]

Hahahaha. Shall we go through the ridiculous points in the USU argument now? Such as it's all one big plot to ruin lefties at university? Or that everybody who supports VOLUNTARY student unionism is SELFISH?

Even if I went to university, I'd get the same response. Already people have been attacking which university people go to. Apparently if you're not at USYD or UNSW, and you're a first year student, you have no basis for argument.

I'm going to CSU in Bathurst. Oh lordy, I doubt I'll be able to comment then...Oh, I'll also add that I'll be living away from home and that I would much prefer to keep my $600 for other living expenses, rather than supporting your social lives

i think the ideology at the heart of VSU support is either short sighted or somewhat selfish
it promotes individualism to an extreme that encourages selfish attitudes
most arguments for VSU here are directed at people having contempt for supporting cultural interests of the uni. i think it undermines university community and encourages a dislocated society
nowhere have i personally criticised someone's viewpoint for being 1st year or from any particular university. i pointed out that it's irritating (not that you weren't able to comment) that treat mine and other's support of USU with such smug scorn without having experienced university life. i feel there's less validity in that argument.

 

[walrusbear]

by the way, is CSU's union fees even $600 dollars?
that's the figure that's been thrown around but that's slightly more than usyd's fees, which would surely be one of the most expensive...

on a sidenote

 

[katie_tully]

i think the ideology at the heart of VSU support is either short sighted or somewhat selfish
it promotes individualism to an extreme that encourages selfish attitudes
most arguments for VSU here are directed at people having contempt for supporting cultural interests of the uni. i think it undermines university community and encourages a dislocated society
nowhere have i personally criticised someone's viewpoint for being 1st year or from any particular university. i pointed out that it's irritating (not that you weren't able to comment) that treat mine and other's support of USU with such smug scorn without having experienced university life. i feel there's less validity in that argument.

Oh boo hoo. I have not seen an argument here for VSU, that says they don't support cultural interests. I've seen arguments against supporting things like the "DJ Competition", or "drinking binges" funded by USU.

As hard as this is for you all to believe the VSU argument isn't based on "undermining" everybody elses cultural interests. There is no conspiracy theory, nobody cares about your social lives enough to go to such extremes to ruin them.

Your argument is it's a them against us attitude we hold, when have you stopped to think we would prefer to keep our $600 for ourselves, to benefit OUR LIVES?

 

[katie_tully]

by the way, is CSU's union fees even $600 dollars?
that's the figure that's been thrown around but that's slightly more than usyd's fees, which would surely be one of the most expensive...

on a sidenote

Not actually sure what they are, but it's more than I'm willing to pay

 

[spin spin sugar]

Even if I went to university, I'd get the same response. Already people have been attacking which university people go to. Apparently if you're not at USYD or UNSW, and you're a first year student, you have no basis for argument.

don't take things out of context. i acknowledged that i had an understanding of NTB's viewpoint because of him going to UWS, i actually SAID MYSELF that i wouldnt use any union services if i went there either. it was an empathetic post, not a critical one, merely highlighting the fact that union activities and services vary greatly from university to university.

and yeah, sorry, but its hard for me to view anything you say as having much credibility when you haven't even experienced campus life first hand. sorry but thats my personal interpretation. your mother being a part time student doesn't make you "fully aware" of anything.

 

[Abu Ghurayb]

I dont think any amount of money could improve the campus experience of CSU. Unless you include being raped by football players.

 

[walrusbear]

Oh boo hoo. I have not seen an argument here for VSU, that says they don't support cultural interests. I've seen arguments against supporting things like the "DJ Competition", or "drinking binges" funded by USU.

As hard as this is for you all to believe the VSU argument isn't based on "undermining" everybody elses cultural interests. There is no conspiracy theory, nobody cares about your social lives enough to go to such extremes to ruin them.

Your argument is it's a them against us attitude we hold, when have you stopped to think we would prefer to keep our $600 for ourselves, to benefit OUR LIVES?

any 'us against them' attitude has been established by both sides
i'm not sure of the point of your last argument, as it's always been very clear to me that you'd rather keep the $600 to benefit 'your lives'. in fact it's the crux of my problem with your argument, ideologically i think it's selfish to expect to attend a university without contributing to its cultural life.
having not been to uni yourself is perhaps why you don't get what i mean. i firmly believe in university as a holistic experience - which i'm sure we can all agree isn't on the cards without a union.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Spin Spin? have you ever experienced university life with VSU?
[no]
Then your comments about how university life will suffer under VSU are invalid.

It's just annoying to have your views thrown to one side because "you haven't experienced it!" "you don't know it like i do!" etc.

 

[spin spin sugar]

do you think i care if she finds it annoying? which i doubt she does anyway, but as i said, it was my personal interpretation of it. youre not going to make me apologise for a personal viewpoint :/

 

[katie_tully]

any 'us against them' attitude has been established by both sides
i'm not sure of the point of your last argument, as it's always been very clear to me that you'd rather keep the $600 to benefit 'your lives'. in fact it's the crux of my problem with your argument, ideologically i think it's selfish to expect to attend a university without contributing to its cultural life.
having not been to uni yourself is perhaps why you don't get what i mean. i firmly believe in university as a holistic experience - which i'm sure we can all agree isn't on the cards without a union.

Last time I checked, we didnt "attend" a university. I think the amount we pay in HECS is plenty of a contribution.

i think it's selfish to expect to attend a university without contributing to its cultural life.

Selfish to whom???! People who attend the "cultural" life at university? WELL GOOD!! If there's that many of you that do it, YOU can fund it, the rest of us can pay our hecs, pay for our books, pay living expenses, go to university, get our degree and move on.

Jesus christ.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Nah i had no REAL great problem with your viewpoint, and I agree, I probably don't experience a union the same way as those at usyd do. All that i've had experience of the union is;
a) people rushing into lectures and demanding that we go striking
b) people bitching about howard
c) people bitching about brendan nelson

 

[spin spin sugar]

yeah ive only heard bad things about uws union, of course the union at usyd is politically minded as well but they organise lots of great events and DO enrich the campus in plenty of ways, whether or not someone would choose to pay for that enrichment, no one at usyd could deny that the union is active and not just in terms of their politics

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Yea but if the union is really great, people will pay for it, and if they don't want to pay for it, it musn't be really that great (in their opinion).

 

[walrusbear]

Last time I checked, we didnt "attend" a university. I think the amount we pay in HECS is plenty of a contribution.


Selfish to whom???! People who attend the "cultural" life at university? WELL GOOD!! If there's that many of you that do it, YOU can fund it, the rest of us can pay our hecs, pay for our books, pay living expenses, go to university, get our degree and move on.

Jesus christ.

this whole 'YOU can fund it' doesn't really hold, since union funds don't work with such partial funding. no one is going to pay union fees, not because they don't think it's worth it, but because the money will be going nowhere because without universal support there won't be enough to fund cultural activities. (in the long run anyway. at the moment i'm pretty sure USYD union has enough money and assets to keep going)

i hope your view of university broadens beyond 'paying, getting your degree, leaving' when you go, else you'll be missing a large part of education.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Walrusbear, if 5000 people at usyd join the union... and those 5000 people ONLY hold events for that 5000 people, then those 5000 people will still be getting SOMETHING.
The union will just have to pretend non-union members don't exist.

What Extra-Curricular activities do you enjoy so much that you can't stand to lose Walrusbear?

 

[walrusbear]

it won't affect me personally TOO much
i'm only in a couple of clubs, eg. flimsoc

isn't that kind of immaterial? why do my interests matter more than everyone elses?

 

[LadyBec]

OMG OH NOES. rofl.

Since when did I need to go to university to comment on the fact that buying groceries and preparing your own food is cheaper in the long run than eating out constantly?
OMG, that's right! I didn't need to go to university to comment!!

Is that the best you have?

my uni has like a mini supermarket, and that food is cheaper then the normal grocery store food.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

my uni has like a mini supermarket, and that food is cheaper then the normal grocery store food.

Impossible. (unless you don't live near any coles or whatever i guess...)