Australian Politics (6 Viewers)

[badquinton304]

I am not sorry. Rudd had to go. It remains to be seen if Julia will back climate change and internet freedom.

I think she is better than rudd. I think there is a better chance of climate change policy and internet freedom with her. But strategically errrrrrrrgggggghhhh...**%&#Q@&f

 

[Slidey]

With Tanner gone, Melbourne is now a guaranteed Greens lower house seat.

 

[Silver Persian]

I think she is better than rudd. I think there is a better chance of climate change policy and internet freedom with her. But strategically errrrrrrrgggggghhhh...**%&#Q@&f

Yeah this.

Although to be honest I know nothing about Gillard's politics.

 

[katie tully]

Yeah this.

Although to be honest I know nothing about Gillard's politics.

Communism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Should teach you everything you need to know about Gillards politics.

 

[Phoenix Fury]

Yeah this.

Although to be honest I know nothing about Gillard's politics.

+1 in regards to both what badquinton said and not knowing about Gillard's politics.

 

[Silver Persian]

Communism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Should teach you everything you need to know about Gillards politics.

Sounds good.

 

[katie tully]

Sounds good.

Ugh

 

[SylviaB]

if a government program doesn't work
its because it needs more funding

 

[Shane_]

if dat gizzard get rid of mining tax, she good thing

 

[Lentern]

Amidst all the chaos I overlooked something that is more horrible a prospect than the rest combined;

Speaker: The deputy prime minister
Member for Lilley: Thankyou Mr speaker, I wish to inform the house that the prime minister will be absent from question time today due to... I will be answering questions on her behalf.

 

[Slidey]

Greens support is surging in Victoria state politics.

Primary vote figures...
Greens: 18%
Labour: 34%
Coalition: 36%

Two party preferred: 51-49 to Labour (but given the high Greens vote this could just easily go the Coalition's way due to unpredictability of preferences)

The Green vote has been hovering around 14% or so for a year now, too, so this isn't simple 'vote parking'. We're seeing Tasmania-like levels of Greens support in Vic.

The same applies on the Federal level - even given Gillard's honeymoon (which I maintain won't last long, especially given she just made some nasty comments about gay marriage), the Greens remain on around 10% federally, which is an increase on their 2007 federal vote.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/pol...s-support-slumps/story-e6frgczx-1225886435872

 

[Slidey]

I just noticed this, too:

The Greens are in a similar position in NSW state politics...
Greens: 16%
Labour: 25%
Coalition: 46%

Two Party preferred: take a wild guess.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/pol...ling-hits-bottom/story-e6frgczx-1225885930325

 

[Lentern]

Greens support is surging in Victoria state politics.

Primary vote figures...
Greens: 18%
Labour: 34%
Coalition: 36%

Two party preferred: 51-49 to Labour (but given the high Greens vote this could just easily go the Coalition's way due to unpredictability of preferences)

The Green vote has been hovering around 14% or so for a year now, too, so this isn't simple 'vote parking'. We're seeing Tasmania-like levels of Greens support in Vic.

The same applies on the Federal level - even given Gillard's honeymoon (which I maintain won't last long, especially given she just made some nasty comments about gay marriage), the Greens remain on around 10% federally, which is an increase on their 2007 federal vote.

John Brumby at risk as support slumps | The Australian

10%? that sounds awfully close to a number someone else floated some weeks ago doesn't it?

 

[Slidey]

10%? that sounds awfully close to a number someone else floated some weeks ago doesn't it?

And it's a number I agreed with you on as a base level of the Greens vote if I recall?

We'll see it at 12% or more on polling day I reckon, but there's no way it will drop below 10%.

 

[Lentern]

Well Slidey are you happy? You agitated for this change and now you have it, a pre Whitlam lefty reviving the nationalistic, union oriented conservatism of the Calwell era. The moves towards compassionate social progressivism and Keynesian social capitalism made by Whitlam and Hayden; Hawke and Keating and yes even that of Beazley and Rudd. With the exception of Latham, no Labor leader in the post Calwell era has harked back to such cheap and ugly politics as this woman is pursuing right now. It is Hansonism cloaked in a thin veil of environmental sustainability, is it any wonder that Tony Abbott and Andrew Bolt seem to be such fans of this new prime minister?

Gillard's enemy is not the dry liberals, the defenders of the Howard legacy. It is the intellectual elite, the urban dwellers like Andrew Peacock and John Hewson. At leas with Latham there was someone who actually understood the western suburbs and bore a genuine concern for the migrant communities in Cabramatta and Merrylands instead of kicking them around like a mangy old political football. Her rhetoric from the day she has taken office has been the horrible old "Put Australia First" sentiment, implicitly, put "white Australia first". It's disgusting. My only comfort is that the old Beazley gang will probably strike her down before the new senators can be sworn in.

 

[spiny norman]

Lentern, Rudd FROZE processing on asylum seekers from two specific racial backgrounds. To try to claim that he (or Beazley, who supported the War in Afghanistan and privately supported Iraq, along with Rudd) was somehow some great champion of muliculturalism and above political pointscoring at the expense of migrants is ludicrous. I'm not going to make some strong advocacy of what she announced today, but I think those labelling it as some great lurch to the right are just reporting what they expected without adjusting for the realities like modern "Dewey Defeats Truman"ites. The refugee camps are to be run with UN input for starters, which makes it a far cry from the inhumanities of the Pacific Solution (or, again, the freezing of processing of two specific races).

Her language hasn't been fantastic but, unfortunately for her (and the ALP), she's got a month to solve something Rudd should've two years ago. It's a hard ask to say she should be able to completely reframe the entire debate that the Coalition was gaining in and promising to send boats back to the warzones they came from is having way too great an expectation on the woman.

Chances are that it'll all fall apart after the election, anyway, when New Zealand and co. decide against it because it's far too costly a venture and then we can get on with redefining the sides of the debate so three years from now we don't have this same situation.

Also, the Inner City Left's calling of Western Suburbanites "rednecks" was terrible, and did more harm than good for what was essentially the right side on the debate. For a group of people from basically homogenous middle class white neighborhoods to call those who, you know, actually live in multicultural areas rednecks just shows why progressiveness loses in society, as far too large a number of those with liberal ideologies are just a bunch of elitist cunts.

 

[Slidey]

Well Slidey are you happy?

Yes.

You agitated for this change and now you have it, a pre Whitlam lefty reviving the nationalistic, union oriented conservatism of the Calwell era. The moves towards compassionate social progressivism and Keynesian social capitalism made by Whitlam and Hayden; Hawke and Keating and yes even that of Beazley and Rudd. With the exception of Latham, no Labor leader in the post Calwell era has harked back to such cheap and ugly politics as this woman is pursuing right now. It is Hansonism cloaked in a thin veil of environmental sustainability, is it any wonder that Tony Abbott and Andrew Bolt seem to be such fans of this new prime minister?

Gillard's enemy is not the dry liberals, the defenders of the Howard legacy. It is the intellectual elite, the urban dwellers like Andrew Peacock and John Hewson. At leas with Latham there was someone who actually understood the western suburbs and bore a genuine concern for the migrant communities in Cabramatta and Merrylands instead of kicking them around like a mangy old political football. Her rhetoric from the day she has taken office has been the horrible old "Put Australia First" sentiment, implicitly, put "white Australia first". It's disgusting. My only comfort is that the old Beazley gang will probably strike her down before the new senators can be sworn in.

OK.

 

[Slidey]

In other news, recapping recent state polling by Newspoll:
WA State Election: Greens on 16%
NSW State Election: Greens on 16%
Victoria State Election: Greens on 18%

 

[Slidey]

In other news, recapping recent state polling by Newspoll:
WA State Election: Greens on 16%
NSW State Election: Greens on 16%
Victoria State Election: Greens on 18%

 

[Lentern]

Yes.

Then you are a moral vacuum.

Lentern, Rudd FROZE processing on asylum seekers from two specific racial backgrounds. To try to claim that he (or Beazley, who supported the War in Afghanistan and privately supported Iraq, along with Rudd) was somehow some great champion of muliculturalism and above political pointscoring at the expense of migrants is ludicrous. I'm not going to make some strong advocacy of what she announced today, but I think those labelling it as some great lurch to the right are just reporting what they expected without adjusting for the realities like modern "Dewey Defeats Truman"ites. The refugee camps are to be run with UN input for starters, which makes it a far cry from the inhumanities of the Pacific Solution (or, again, the freezing of processing of two specific races).

I would wager everything I own and more that Rudd made that decision(if he took it at all) against his better instincts and did so to sooth the rumblings of the Kelvin Thompsons and Laurrie Fergusons in the party. Certainly cowardice is not something to be praised but given the man was knifed for being a social democrat and for refusing to treat asylum seekers like a political football, he can be forgiven.

I'm not even sure whether your defending this ugly side of labor as being innocent of the charges I've thrown at them, or turning round and saying "what of it?" What does the war on terror have to do with this? They didn't support a war in order to screw over some arabs they did it in hope that two states capable of being great, proud countries would be able to grow to fruition under democracy.

And when Rudd's policies been at times unfair, they were never xenophobic. His rhetoric was never implying that there was good reason to be scared or disdainful of migrants like Gillard's is, it was always framed carefully to avoid doing so.

Her language hasn't been fantastic but, unfortunately for her (and the ALP), she's got a month to solve something Rudd should've two years ago. It's a hard ask to say she should be able to completely reframe the entire debate that the Coalition was gaining in and promising to send boats back to the warzones they came from is having way too great an expectation on the woman.

She should have buggered the coalition as Rudd did! She has given so much credence to this horrible, nasty xenophobia since she became prime minister, credence which she can never take back. During the oceanic viking crisis Rudd refused to debate the issue in parliament at the expense of his own personal image so that the scaremongering would get minimal press coverage. Rudd was still ahead in the polls, in a better position than John Howard of Bob Hawke had been in three years into their premiership, the coalition was gaining ground because it was an election year.

Chances are that it'll all fall apart after the election, anyway, when New Zealand and co. decide against it because it's far too costly a venture and then we can get on with redefining the sides of the debate so three years from now we don't have this same situation.

It'll have to or she'll lose half her cabinet in resignations. But she deserves to be cut no slack because she's merely whipping up xenophobia and not actually intending to act upon it.

Also, the Inner City Left's calling of Western Suburbanites "rednecks" was terrible, and did more harm than good for what was essentially the right side on the debate. For a group of people from basically homogenous middle class white neighborhoods to call those who, you know, actually live in multicultural areas rednecks just shows why progressiveness loses in society, as far too large a number of those with liberal ideologies are just a bunch of elitist cunts.

I live in those western suburbs bro, I have lived in Guildford all my life, I was schooled in Liverpool, my extended family all comes from Blacktown. Don't tell me I don't know the impacts that migration has had on the area and I know from whom the voices of complaints come and Julia Burnside was absolutely right to call them rednecks. His later statement that the comment needed to be read in context disapointed me because there is no better word than encapsulates those backward thinking, simple minded, parochial bumpkins than "redneck."