Voting at 16 (2 Viewers)

[Chemical Ali]

Why would the 5% who come by boats be more scary than majority coming by planes but for some bonkers nationalistic sentiment about deciding who comes in.

The "95% come by plane" thing needs to become moar memetic so that whenever someone mentions "the boats" they get that as an automatic response from everyone, lol

 

[cosmo kramer]

Nonsense those are proxies for what is little more than mean spirited bigotry.

even if it was how is that wrong

would you invite somebody you dont like into your house

eitherway the yelling mobs sure have an odd way of expressing their mean spirited bigotry by protesting the tiny number of people who arrive here by boat but seemingly not giving a shit about the thousands of refugees who arrive here by other means not to mention all the legal immigrants

 

[Lentern]

The "95% come by plane" thing needs to become moar memetic so that whenever someone mentions "the boats" they get that as an automatic response from everyone, lol

Why? You can't get rid of an irrational hatred with facts and statistics. Better off telling people that there's candy in the boats.

 

[Jimmy Recard]

Why would the 5% who come by boats be more scary than majority coming by planes but for some bonkers nationalistic sentiment about deciding who comes in.

how the fuck would i know you clown

 

[Lentern]

how the fuck would i know you clown

Deny it if you will, everything I've seen you write to date suggests I'd be better off trying to reason with Barnsey.

 

[Lentern]

even if it was how is that wrong

would you invite somebody you dont like into your house

eitherway the yelling mobs sure have an odd way of expressing their mean spirited bigotry by protesting the tiny number of people who arrive here by boat but seemingly not giving a shit about the thousands of refugees who arrive here by other means not to mention all the legal immigrants

A much bigger proportion of non-boat immigrants are Anglo-European.

 

[cosmo kramer]

A much bigger proportion of non-boat immigrants are Anglo-European.

and

 

[Jimmy Recard]

i was not serious about denying aboriginals the right to vote you know

it was a hypothetical argument about the merits of voting based on aspects of contribution to society (children havent contributed/unemployed dont contribute)

contrast and compare son

 

[Chemical Ali]

Why? You can't get rid of an irrational hatred with facts and statistics. Better off telling people that there's candy in the boats.

Well it just seems to me that the whole public discourse/perception of stuff moves (slowly) in terms of memes, for example most people now keep the line "islam is not a race" handy in case they need to justify saying nasty things about brown people. Or another one might be "Howard stopped the boats", when he really just changed the way they were counted and let 95% of them in eventually anyway. There's probably some from the other side but I can't think of any right now.

 

[Riet]

I think it should be optional voting 16-18. Only the politically aware would vote then. Can't really make it compulsory for under 18's because who would be fined for them not turning up and they're not adults so they can't really assume legal responsibility.

Personally, I've been pretty politically since age 14 or so and can't wait till I can vote. However, I think the politically passionate in my age group are probably a minority, but then again politically aware adults are probably the minority.

Btw, funnily enough I had a debate on keeping at eighteen and lost arguing that

That is fucking stupid. Being "politically aware" when you have a very limited world view and fuck all life experience is synonymous with parroting whatever your parents told you growing up and acting like a self-aggrandised wanker.

18 is the age of majority, simple as that.

^You'd think that with how many people don't care, but then that begs the questions "Does that still make it democracy if not everyone is having a say?". And then there's questions if then people can be intimidated to not vote etc.

whoa that's so deep! Ever consider that if it were a democracy I wouldn't be coerced into voting?

 

[Riet]

Perhaps if there was a political information class where high-schoolers could have a chance to be unbiasedly educated about either party and make an informed non compulsory decision where friendly debate is encouraged.

Regardless of whether you decide to vote or not I think it should be compulsory to be educated without a political bias.

This is all just nonsense. For a start the assumption that there are only 2 sides to the political spectrum, especially when they are so similar does nothing but reinforce the hegemony of self-serving governments who look out for their buddies. Fuck that state. Who would decide what is "unbiased"? Are you going to establish a 'bias-in-education' committee to ensure teachers aren't biased? Will this be controlled by the government or an independent authority ensuring the anti-bias board isn't biased?

Besides, being 'educated about the party'? What is this, North Korea? Both parties have evolved and continue to evolve since their origins and aside from the racist, protectionist dickwads known as the National Party, both are guided by populism feeding on the 24-hour news cycle, rather than some over-arching philosophy.

Teach kids maths, science and english etc., worry about voting later.

 

[Rafy]

If you pay any tax you should be able to vote.

 

[Jimmy Recard]

We would be better served if kids could somehow be taught the processes of critical thinking, the nature of logic, burdens of proof and all that jazz. An unbiased political education doesn't really exist.

posterity

 

[Riet]

If you pay any tax you should be able to vote.

disagree, this implies that my vote costs significantly more than someone who paid $1 of tax. Instead you should get more votes if you pay more tax, obviously this system would be the most fair.

 

[LoveHateSchool]

Believe it or not Riet, I actually have different political views from my parents and don't just parrot them.

I understand eighteen is an arbitrary age where you receive most of your rights. But I don't see how there is much difference between a 17 year old and 18 year old because most tend to both still be in highschool. Some 18 year olds will have just finished, be on GAP or in first year uni. Seeing my peers, most of them don't know much about politics at all, but they would not vote if it was optional for under 18's. And if it's option for 16-17, it eliminates any of the fining etc. issues.

But eh, I'll be able to vote soon enough, right in time for the next local govt. elections.

 

[Riet]

At 18 or shortly after most people finish highschool and start living in the real world. It's not like elections occur every year anyway so the first time people vote will fluctuate between 18 and 21. The fact most of your peers don't know much about politics at all is irrelevant. Voting isn't just about politics, in fact it'd be better if everyone ignore the politics and focussed on the outcomes. Regardless of whether or not you read the SMH and think you're politically aware; I'd question your experience with economics, finance, civil liberties and law and justice.

 

[Funky Monk]

Well it just seems to me that the whole public discourse/perception of stuff moves (slowly) in terms of memes, for example most people now keep the line "islam is not a race" handy in case they need to justify saying nasty things about brown people. Or another one might be "Howard stopped the boats", when he really just changed the way they were counted and let 95% of them in eventually anyway. There's probably some from the other side but I can't think of any right now.

how did this work?

 

[Blastus]

How do people think boats arriving on Christmas Island will impact them?

because they're racist?

 

[Blastus]

Believe it or not Riet, I actually have different political views from my parents and don't just parrot them.

I understand eighteen is an arbitrary age where you receive most of your rights. But I don't see how there is much difference between a 17 year old and 18 year old because most tend to both still be in highschool. Some 18 year olds will have just finished, be on GAP or in first year uni. Seeing my peers, most of them don't know much about politics at all, but they would not vote if it was optional for under 18's. And if it's option for 16-17, it eliminates any of the fining etc. issues.

But eh, I'll be able to vote soon enough, right in time for the next local govt. elections.

let me guess your parents are conservative and you vote greens oh okay

 

[Blastus]

compulsory voting is fucking retarded