Use of the word 'gay'... (2 Viewers)

[Kwayera]

so which ones ghey cat?

Gay = homosexual.
Ghey = stupid, idiotic, retarded

 

[xeuyrawp]

Yes I understand that words have multiple meanings, and I agree that when people use the term gay they are usually not explicitly referring to same-sex desiring individuals. I also said that I tried to make people uncomfortable about it primarily as a joke. You seem to enjoy selectively editing my posts.

But I would be interested in your thoughts about the fact that almost every word that refers to gay people (fag, queer, homo) gets used in the same way. Is it just a coincidence that our language has developed in such that any word meaning gay becomes a term that can also mean bad/weak/abnormal?

Not sure what to say to the first paragraph (apparently I can't just respond to one part)? It's still stupid. :-\

As for the second part, you clearly don't understand. Yes, there's a relationship between the three usages of gay, but that's only a relationship in how they were formed, not what they mean.

Let's take 'queer' as it's clearer. If someone says to you 'shutup, queer!', they're clearly using the meaning 'queer' (homosexual).

That has absolutely nothing to do with the word's meaning itself (or the other meaning of 'queer' (unusual)) but rather entirely on the speaker. You can use essentially a wide range of words in this context. And this is exactly my point, you cannot wage a war on word meanings, like the gay community wants to, because the usage of any word is dictated entirely on context.

Like I said, since lexical meanings are entirely contextual, it is no surprise that every word referring to gay people has been used offensively - fag, homo, queer, gay - as homosexuality is seen as wrong. But these are different meanings of the words and are as irrelevant as the words themselves.

What I'm saying (again) is that if you have a problem with people saying 'gay' (bad), you don't understand the crux of the issue, which is that word choice is essentially irrelevant for this purpose. How many words and phrases are they for 'gay' in a negative context? I could think of 50, I would say. Hence it is completely useless to attack any single usage of any single word, but try to get to the problem which is homophobia, and not single word choice.

So yes, do I think that saying 'shutup, queer!' is bad? I think it's entirely contextual. In some contexts it may be funny, in others it may be offensive. I'd prefer to not simply erase one of the word's meaning.

Lastly, I personally really think that people who say 'oh you can't say "gay" like that' make people want to say 'gay' more, as you're completely fulfilling their expectations that gay people are annoying and generally bad.

 

[Riet]

Gay is a slang term for homosexual, it's also a slang term for retarded shit, its not like in the dictionary it says: "homosexual adj. 1. sexually attracted to members of the same sex 2. retarded, stupid or lame."
Slang evolves, this is a non issue IMO and people who whinge about it are well... gay.

 

[John McCain]

You guys are cool and all, and the contextual use is fine, but for a substantial proportion of the community the language is overtly and deliberately used to reflect their own homophobia. When their shit gets fucked up, and they remark that the situation is 'gay', they are consciously and readily associating it with the other meaning.

Whereas racial slurs will make you a social pariah, genuinely homophobic individuals are given tacit acceptability because of the casual use of these words. The appropriate reaction of shock and distaste when genuine homophobia is voiced, is diminished because of the casual use and familiarity of these words.

By using these words, it makes these individuals feel their attitudes have a degree of acceptance and respect in the community. Which really, they do.

The contextual, other, acceptable meaning of these words, by everyone, makes life easier for homophobic individuals, and makes them feel comfortable and accepted in the community. Making social pariahs out of individuals who voice hate, is one of the most effective ways to bring positive change, the permissiveness of these words currently allows individuals to feel society accepts their attitude.

That aside, I dislike the aesthetics of it, it's as unpleasant as racial slurs to me, I could call my makes 'gooks' and 'niggers' when they do dumb shit, but I choose not to.

 

[xeuyrawp]

... /facepalm. Saying 'gay' (bad) has nothing to do with homosexuality in so many cases of its usage. You're drawing a line which a lot of gay people do, of course, just to be more the victim and to whinge about pointless, superficial crap.

Your analogy with racial slurs is false because there is no usage of 'nigger' (bad) the same way that there is 'gay' (bad). I can't say, 'oh, my computer broke - that's just nigger!', can I?

I can say 'fuck off, nigger', which is offensive given that the usage of 'nigger' is now limited to a specific speech community (African-Americans). However if I'm black, I could say 'hey, nigger, what's up?' and this would be fine in many contexts. Thus you can see the point that words are completely contextual and that any given word cannot be standardised.

To be honest, I can't really understand what you're getting at with the rest of your post. Saying 'gay' is not institutionalised homophobia, if that's what you mean.

Edit: Okay this could really go in circles, and I really cbf. The bottom line as I see it is that people who attack one word, or one usage, don't understand language. Language of course reflects its context. If you think me saying 'my computer's gay!' is homophobic, then you should attack homophobia and not some random word that I choose.

 

[s-p-a-c-e-d]

oh, i thought this topic would be about this website

Think before you speak. Don't say "That's So Gay."

which is really fucking dumb btw...

like, srsly dumb

 

[John McCain]

Ofcourse, it frequently has nothing to do with homosexuality, but individuals who choose to use it and are genuinely homophobic, are able to hide behind the acceptance created by the casual use of the word.

Your analogy with racial slurs is false because there is no usage of 'nigger' (bad) the same way that there is 'gay' (bad). I can't say, 'oh, my computer broke - that's just nigger!', can I?

One is an adj and the other a noun, so no you can't substitute one for the other. However you could substitute nigger in place of another noun, such as homo. I don't know what point you're making with this.

idk, is it a good idea to go around calling people who piss me off "dumb gooks" or whatever? I understand clearly the technical differences between the contextual meanings of the words, but I think you're underestimating the power of language if you don't think language works to create meaning in society, and that the negative use of the word gay has no impact on people's identities or attitudes to each other.

 

[kokodamonkey]

Gay is a slang term for homosexual, it's also a slang term for retarded shit, its not like in the dictionary it says: "homosexual adj. 1. sexually attracted to members of the same sex 2. retarded, stupid or lame."
Slang evolves, this is a non issue IMO and people who whinge about it are well... gay.

exactly!

 

[xeuyrawp]

I don't know what point you're making with this.

... My point is that it's a false analogy (regardless of word class; take two nouns like 'nigger' and 'homo' then).

idk, is it a good idea to go around calling people who piss me off "dumb gooks"

ummm do you understand false analogy...? You wouldn't generally call people who piss you off 'dumb gooks' because it's not a meaning of the word...? If 'gook' happened to have two contextual meanings, like 'gay' does, then yes you could say it. However it doesn't. Afaik, none of the racial slurs operate like 'gay' does. Yes, 'gay' (bad) comes from 'gay' (homosexual) but that's no more relevant than saying 'Um, sorry, you can't call the HSC "Senior Science" because science just means learning'. How a word came to be is interesting but irrelevant when compared to the meaning of it.

Not sure if you understand the whole analogy thing that you're making.

 

[copkiller]

idk, is it a good idea to go around calling people who piss me off "dumb gooks"

Yes.

It's a phenomenal idea.

Thanks for the tip.

 

[John McCain]

On looking up the meaning of 'false analogy', you're right it, it is so in a certain context. I apologize and retract something something.

However, I'm not so certain that in the wider community, the seperation between the two contextual meanings is as absolute as you insist. I think an association between the two meanings still exists for many people. For them, the divide between 'gay' as a general reference to anything bad, and it's homophobic origins is not entrenched, an association still exists.

Slurs like 'gook' and especially jew related stuff, can and are used in the same way and context as 'homo', can be used as a general insult against someone of any ethnic group, same as retard and what have you.

Would you feel similarly comfortable that the common slang definition of jew- someone who is tight with money- can now be considered completely separate from its anti-semetic origins, when used in the appropiate context?

 

[Silver Persian]

Not sure what to say to the first paragraph (apparently I can't just respond to one part)? It's still stupid. :-\

As for the second part, you clearly don't understand. Yes, there's a relationship between the three usages of gay, but that's only a relationship in how they were formed, not what they mean.

Let's take 'queer' as it's clearer. If someone says to you 'shutup, queer!', they're clearly using the meaning 'queer' (homosexual).

That has absolutely nothing to do with the word's meaning itself (or the other meaning of 'queer' (unusual)) but rather entirely on the speaker. You can use essentially a wide range of words in this context. And this is exactly my point, you cannot wage a war on word meanings, like the gay community wants to, because the usage of any word is dictated entirely on context.

Like I said, since lexical meanings are entirely contextual, it is no surprise that every word referring to gay people has been used offensively - fag, homo, queer, gay - as homosexuality is seen as wrong. But these are different meanings of the words and are as irrelevant as the words themselves.

What I'm saying (again) is that if you have a problem with people saying 'gay' (bad), you don't understand the crux of the issue, which is that word choice is essentially irrelevant for this purpose. How many words and phrases are they for 'gay' in a negative context? I could think of 50, I would say. Hence it is completely useless to attack any single usage of any single word, but try to get to the problem which is homophobia, and not single word choice.

So yes, do I think that saying 'shutup, queer!' is bad? I think it's entirely contextual. In some contexts it may be funny, in others it may be offensive. I'd prefer to not simply erase one of the word's meaning.

Yeah ok, I pretty much agree with this, fag.

 

[Tangent]

Gay. I call shit things gay all the time.

When I call something/someone gay, I don't have the meaning 'homosexual' in mind, just like 40 years ago when gay wasn't associated with homosexuality either.

I don't know many gay people who are offended by the use of 'gay' as a derogatory word. I know a heap of retarded fucking 'gay rights campaigners' who do, but they can stfu because they're gay cunts.

Why not use another word though? If it makes someone else happy, then isnt it a small price to pay?

 

[Napstar]

Why not use another word though? If it makes someone else happy, then isnt it a small price to pay?

See my other post.

I don't think gay people should be above ridicule any more than any other friends of mine.

People say shit that I find offensive all the time. I build a bridge and get over it.

Don't be such a fag Tangent.

 

[Tangent]

See my other post.

I don't think gay people should be above ridicule any more than any other friends of mine.

People say shit that I find offensive all the time. I build a bridge and get over it.

Don't be such a fag Tangent.

I'm refering to any word that causes someone offense, not just the word gay.

and i cant help it Y-Y

 

[Napstar]

Because if I spent my time worrying about offending lollygaggers and wowsers and any other spastic that exists, I wouldn't be able to open my mouth ever.

If people get offended by something, I really don't care hey.

 

[cactuar]

i use the words gay/fag/homo etc all the time. i've never thought about it much until recently because of how much it's become a regular part of my vocabulary. i stand by the fact that there is nothing wrong with saying it because it is just a word. i dont bully people by saying they are homo/fags/gay, and i never would. at most, i say it to my mates in jest.

 

[Tangent]

Because if I spent my time worrying about offending lollygaggers and wowsers and any other spastic that exists, I wouldn't be able to open my mouth ever.

If people get offended by something, I really don't care hey.

So we shouldn't care what comes out of our mouths, even if it does hurt someone?

Strive to equally insult everyone?

 

[roar84eighty]

C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER

fag

 

[Napstar]

So we shouldn't care what comes out of our mouths, even if it does hurt someone?

Strive to equally insult everyone?

Basically.

You don't have the right to not be offended.