Do you support the use of Torture ? (2 Viewers)

[moll.]

I would say that that's not even effective.
The enemy will be more demoralised when they realise that they are the bad guys imo


Having said that, maybe it's sufficient for, like, prison guards to adopt hidden policies, like casting henious criminals down into cells with the sodomites??

Though this is cowardly imo. The state should be honest, it should be a man, when it comes to punishment

lol.
Cos this happens a lot, right?

 

[Iron]

lol we'll guilt them for years regardless

it's only immoral if you lose!

 

[squiresshane990]

haha but seriously the japs are a disgusting cruel people and nothing we did even came close

 

[Iron]

strange thing is they make bloody good cameras, the swine

 

[Graney]

Nah, we're talking to replace capital puishment. So only for convicted serial killers who don't get parole. No harm in permenantly deforming them, both mentally and physically.

There's no utilitarian harm to society, but I'm sure the prisoner would disagee there's no harm in being permanently deformed. There's a harm to the torturer.

But what benefit is there?

 

[Iron]

Anyone arguing against torture have something to hide and should therefore be the first ones tortured

but in my benign little state, we'd use feathers and stuff i suppose

 

[pman]

If u r at war, torture seems a bit like the germans gassing method, its immorral and not all that sensible, but if they r torturing ur guys, then they r asking to be tortured as well

 

[Iron]

NO
Theyre asking for a cuddle

 

[moll.]

There's no utilitarian harm to society, but I'm sure the prisoner would disagee there's no harm in being permanently deformed. There's a harm to the torturer.

But what benefit is there?

Of course he's going to disagree. That's the point.
And whether or not the torturer would be left emotionally scarred depends on the individual torturer. A lot of people can be desensitised to their actions and jobs and not consciously feel guilt for it.
Why do you think no-one in Abu-Ghraib raised the alarm in disgust at the inhumane treatment?
Because they were used to it.
The benefit is revenge. Also deterence. You're less likely to go on a murderous rampage if you believe that you will be tortured every day until your eventual and slow death, rather than simply locked up at nights.

 

[v26]

generally i'm against it

 

[pman]

When i look at a gaol term, i think, that would absolutley suck, being bum raped, having no freedom, having to share my room with 10-20 others, having somebody else deciding when i can move about. i would be dead in a week....on the other hand torture would be a little worse

 

[Graney]

The benefit is revenge.

Barbarian.

You're less likely to go on a murderous rampage if you believe that you will be tortured every day until your eventual and slow death, rather than simply locked up at nights.

[citation needed]

If you're talking about crimes of passion, that doesn't work. Are you only proposing torture for mass murderers? Because that's an exceedingly rare thing, especially in this country, it's a lot of hassle to go to for special treatment for a handfull of people.

Given that many serial killers could be diagnosed with significant psychological problems, mental illnesses and the like, to what extent are they deserving of revenge if they were simply acting on their unalterable biological drives? The nature of the man made no other course of action possible.

I've been meaning to make a thread for some time on the issues of punishment and free will.

 

[moll.]

Barbarian.


[citation needed]

If you're talking about crimes of passion, that doesn't work. Are you only proposing torture for mass murderers? Because that's an exceedingly rare thing, especially in this country, it's a lot of hassle to go to for special treatment for a handfull of people.

Given that many serial killers could be diagnosed with significant psychological problems, mental illnesses and the like, to what extent are they deserving of revenge if they were simply acting on their unalterable biological drives? The nature of the man made no other course of action possible.

I've been meaning to make a thread for some time on the issues of punishment and free will.

Personal evidence. CBF finding objective evidence.
Even if it doesn't work with crimes of passion and the mentally unstable, it's not going to increase these killings either. And it most certainly would work with pre-meditated homocides.
Ergo, overall gain.

 

[pman]

Is surgically removing someones eyes using aneasthetic torture?

 

[moll.]

Is surgically removing someones eyes using aneasthetic torture?

Psychological and emotional torture. Also it's going to hurt once they wake up.

 

[pman]

I hereby suport enforced blindness

 

[Graney]

Personal evidence.

You have personal experience torturing people?

CBF finding objective evidence.

There is none.

And it most certainly would work with pre-meditated homocides.
Ergo, overall gain.

Having a criminal justice system does seem like it would reasonably be a detterant. But increasing sentences do not necessarily have an effect upon crime rates and it's not certain torture would act as a greater detterant than imprisonment alone.

 

[pman]

I definatly would rather be blind than in prison

 

[pman]

Your assumptions are still unproved. You say personal evidence, then don't even go on to give one example. Here are some of the drawbacks of what you are suggesting:

-Psychological toll on the people who perform the torture.
-Psychological toll on the family of the convicted person knowing that they are being tortured.
-Possibility that the convict is later proven innocent. The psychological damage from the torture may make them so angry, hateful and emotionally destroyed that even though they were initially innocent, they have no real chance of being able to re-integrate into normal society.

You seem to assume that once someone commits certain crimes, we no longer need to treat them as a human being.

You have provided no evidence that torturing them would make anyone better off, but we can be certain that it would make those who are being tortured much worse off.

From a utilitarian perspective you are creating a lot of human suffering for a gain that is speculative at best.

Zim, you assume that people who have spent years ingaol can readily assimilate into modern society. if you have read the shawshank redemption, you will understand what i am saying, imagine if you had been placed in gaol when cars where rare, when u were released almost everyone had a car, you would be run over almost instantly or driven to suicide

 

[moll.]

You have personal experience torturing people?

What? Wasn't the citation needed in reference to motivation to murder being less with the threat of torture?
Cos that's what I was talking about. I know I wouldn't be as likely to kill if I was facing torture, rather than imprisonmet.

There is none.


Having a criminal justice system does seem like it would reasonably be a detterant. But increasing sentences do not necessarily have an effect upon crime rates and it's not certain torture would act as a greater detterant than imprisonment alone.

I'm still working off personal evidence. I'm pretty sure there's not specific evidence for nor against the use of torture as a punishment having any effect upon crime rates.